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2019 Green Bay Packers Season Thread

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Offline  2019 Green Bay Packers Season Thread
#1

Posted: August 05, 2019, 10:12 AM Post
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Now that training camp is in full swing let's make a thread specifically for the 2019 season.

Hard to say how realistic any of the reports we get are until they start hitting people for realzies, but it seems there are a number of guys flashing really well so far:
- Most of the receiving corps but Trevor Davis, J'Mon Moore, and Whitewater Jesus have been mentioned by name by coaches and writers
- Defense almost always is ahead of offense at this point but it seems like they are really performing well.
- Rashan Gary has been living up to 1st round billing. I will be first to eat crow if he comes in and plays great.
- Za'Darius Smith is another getting mentioned as near unstoppable. Granted he's playing against 2nd and 3rd teamers most of the time but still...encouraging.
- Tony Brown is all over the place
- Kevin King is hurt again....surprise, surprise. Hope he can stay healthy as I really like his game.
- Montravious Adams. Would be HUGE if he could produce.

"Dustin Pedroia doesn't have the strength or bat speed to hit major-league pitching consistently, and he has no power......He probably has a future as a backup infielder if he can stop rolling over to third base and shortstop." Keith Law, 2006


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Offline  Re: 2019 Green Bay Packers Season Thread
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Posted: August 05, 2019, 11:07 AM Post
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Time just absolutely zips by as I age. Granted I don't hang on offseason news like I used to. But I cannot believe there's a preseason game this week. I'd rather watch paint dry, but the summer almost felt nonexistent.

Anyway I'm excited about the defense. I'm not expecting more than 9 wins but who knows, could get something special if the defense is the real deal. The NFL allows for those rapid transitions. I'm just hoping for a break from taking the first month of the season off. I was really getting tired of that under McCarthy.

I was also pretty happy when I caught a soudbite of LaFleuer talking about guys dogging it in practice and how it irks him. He doesn't want to do conditioning after practice, and feels like practice should be strenuous enough to serve as conditioning. McCarthy coached soft practices and we had soft teams. I would love to see that killed.


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Offline  Re: 2019 Green Bay Packers Season Thread
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Posted: August 05, 2019, 1:12 PM Post
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homer said:
Now that training camp is in full swing let's make a thread specifically for the 2019 season.

Hard to say how realistic any of the reports we get are until they start hitting people for realzies, but it seems there are a number of guys flashing really well so far:
- Most of the receiving corps but Trevor Davis, J'Mon Moore, and Whitewater Jesus have been mentioned by name by coaches and writers
- Defense almost always is ahead of offense at this point but it seems like they are really performing well.
- Rashan Gary has been living up to 1st round billing. I will be first to eat crow if he comes in and plays great.
- Za'Darius Smith is another getting mentioned as near unstoppable. Granted he's playing against 2nd and 3rd teamers most of the time but still...encouraging.
- Tony Brown is all over the place
- Kevin King is hurt again....surprise, surprise. Hope he can stay healthy as I really like his game.
- Montravious Adams. Would be HUGE if he could produce.



I watched that Family night scrimmage and while you can only take some bits as pieces from that as anything useful, all night I thought it was Za'Darius Smith who was just dominating matchup's. I assumed he was 91 and Preston Smith was 55. Turns out it was flipped, so I didn't notice Za'Darius Smith, but man, Preston Smith looked outstanding.

He lined up over Lane Taylor and absolutely blew by him. He lined up over Bakhtiari and walked him back...and was basically just a wrecking ball.

We've all heard about what Za'Darius Smith is doing in practice.

As for that other time, Taylor was beaten BADLY, Adams came over the line and did a beautiful rip and just blew right past him. One of those pass rushes that just destroys a play. Heck, even if it was a handoff, that was going nowhere.

I really am starting to doubt Taylor makes this teams final roster. Like I said in another thread, the dropoff to...Jenkins or Turner or McCray is just not worth the difference in salary.

Rashan Gary...everything I've seen from him so far, most of which came on Family night, though I did catch a practice because I happened to be up in the area, but he looks so fluid and explosive. It's not hard to picture him playing a 5 technique in rushing situations, but man, I could also see him being able to drop off and cover the flats or a hook zone. He just moves so much better than I thought he'd be able to laterally. Again, just compared to the other guys.

Tony Brown-Absolutely looks good, but all their DB's did. King looked good.


Offensively-
Kumerow looked really good. I did not realize he was 6'4. I remember when he was at Whitewater a friend of mine was raving about the QB and the WR looking like they could be NFL players, naturally I thought he was exaggerating. Obviously, he was not.

Trevor Davis looks like he's taken a big step.

Oh, and my guy, my breakout star for this year or next, Robert Tonyan looks like he could be a real weapon.


So far the pass rush looks relentless.
I'm a little disappointed we're not seeing or hearing more about St. Brown, but it sounds like Adams, MVS, Allison, Kumerow and Davis are pretty well locked in at WR'er.
The DB's, it's hard to really see what you have when you're trying to not go to the ground or take someone else to the ground, so you're not really coming in there and ripping at the ball when they catch it. The perfect example of this was a catch on a deep post with King lined at RCB and Rodgers hit someone(I thought it was MVS, but not positive) for a perfect throw and he went up and made a really nice catch in the air, but King was right on him. Who knows if he breaks that up in the game, but he was in a great position.


I just read about King's hammy. I really hope it's just a training camp thing. They said they don't believe it's an issue, so I won't worry about it until it becomes something more. But this guy has to get on the field this year for 14 games and find a way to stay healthy. It was why I was hoping they'd bring Breeland back. You need some depth when you're counting on a guy who's been injured his first two years and a guy who's undersized to be your starting corners.


All in all, the defense looks like they're really looking great thus far, small sample size though it may be, Tony Brown, Montravius Adams, Raven Green, and even Hollman and Summers looked pretty active. Though the latter I would assume is a special teamers at best for the Packers this year.


This team just kinda feels like that team in 2005 or 2006 that Favre called the most talented Packers team he played on. We had a bunch of really talented rookies/2nd year players like Collings, Jennings, Hawk and then some other players who weren't quite core players, but guys like Jarrett Bush who were extremely important in building a complete team.

Now this team didn't draft guys like Finley, Collins, Jennins that we know of, but they sure went out and spent a lot of money to get some really productive and probably more importantly, reliable pass rushers.


It's just fun to see a team coming together from what little we can see after they ACTUALLY went out and addressed the big areas of concern that even conservative Packer fans like me have called for. I was fine with them just keeping their own guys when they were hitting on draft picks and Rodgers was in his 20's, started to get frustrated when those Pro-Bowl hits became above-average starter picks and then just bad picks and we weren't doing anything about it.


Finally, it's gonna be interesting to see if Crosby holds onto the Kicker job. I have a hard time believing that they're going to let him go this year, but Ficken has a MONSTER leg. Thought I was watching Justin Tucker out there or Greg Z-whatever. Greg the leg. Hit that 63 yarder with about 10 yards to spare.


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Offline  Re: 2019 Green Bay Packers Season Thread
#4

Posted: August 05, 2019, 1:33 PM Post
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I'm excited to see Savage finally get some reps.

"Dustin Pedroia doesn't have the strength or bat speed to hit major-league pitching consistently, and he has no power......He probably has a future as a backup infielder if he can stop rolling over to third base and shortstop." Keith Law, 2006


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Online  Re: 2019 Green Bay Packers Season Thread
#5

Posted: August 05, 2019, 1:42 PM Post
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Can you really take what lineman do in a scrimmage seriously? I would imagine the more injury prone offensive lineman wouldn't put in much effort to avoid injury and the fact you can't get to the QB anyway. Because falling on Rodger's leg and hurting him would likely end in a permanent ban from the league. When I watch bits and pieces it seems most are just practicing footwork and the first 3 seconds of a play.

I could see where someone actually needing to perform or someone who always goes 100% looking like JJ Watt.


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Offline  Re: 2019 Green Bay Packers Season Thread
#6

Posted: August 05, 2019, 1:50 PM Post
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Just read an article on The Athletic today how Za'Darius Smith is mentoring Rashan Gary. Smith is quoted saying he sees a lot of himself in Gary, similar builds and play styles coming out of college, Smith notes how Gary's skills exceeded his own at that age. And Gary is pummelling Smith with questions about everything and just watching everything Smith is doing. Love hearing that, seems like Gary has the work ethic and desire for knowledge and Smith proactively wants to be there to help Gary any way he can.

Worth a read if you have a subscription:
‘I’m like your big brother’: How Za’Darius Smith is taking Rashan Gary under his wing


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Offline  Re: 2019 Green Bay Packers Season Thread
#7

Posted: August 05, 2019, 5:15 PM Post
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Has their been any talk about moving Tony Brown to Safety? He just seems like a ballhawk, explode to the ball type of player. Maybe just too small for safety or what? I'll hang up and listen.

As for the defense in general, can almost guarantee they'll be better. But these days its all about red zone defense, getting turnovers, giving up big plays, and 3rd down defense. Probably in that order. How well they do in those areas will be the difference between a good defense and a great one.

O line is the only group that concerns me.

There will be some real tough cuts this year, seems like its been a few years since that was the case.


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Offline  Re: 2019 Green Bay Packers Season Thread
#8

Posted: August 05, 2019, 6:03 PM Post
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homer said:
- Most of the receiving corps but Trevor Davis, J'Mon Moore, and Whitewater Jesus have been mentioned by name by coaches and writers

Kind of ironic that over the offseason these were the guys mentioned the most as getting cut (or wanting to get cut).


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Offline  Re: 2019 Green Bay Packers Season Thread
#9

Posted: August 05, 2019, 8:15 PM Post
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LouisEly said:
homer said:
- Most of the receiving corps but Trevor Davis, J'Mon Moore, and Whitewater Jesus have been mentioned by name by coaches and writers

Kind of ironic that over the offseason these were the guys mentioned the most as getting cut (or wanting to get cut).


Well, Trevor Davis is hurt again, so there's that. That's been the knock on him ... can't stay out of the training room. If they keep him, I fear they will be disappointed yet again.


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Offline  Re: 2019 Green Bay Packers Season Thread
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Posted: August 06, 2019, 5:48 PM Post
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Spriggs waived.

"Dustin Pedroia doesn't have the strength or bat speed to hit major-league pitching consistently, and he has no power......He probably has a future as a backup infielder if he can stop rolling over to third base and shortstop." Keith Law, 2006


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Offline  Re: 2019 Green Bay Packers Season Thread
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Posted: August 06, 2019, 6:23 PM Post
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MrTPlush said:
Can you really take what lineman do in a scrimmage seriously? I would imagine the more injury prone offensive lineman wouldn't put in much effort to avoid injury and the fact you can't get to the QB anyway. Because falling on Rodger's leg and hurting him would likely end in a permanent ban from the league. When I watch bits and pieces it seems most are just practicing footwork and the first 3 seconds of a play.

I could see where someone actually needing to perform or someone who always goes 100% looking like JJ Watt.



Of course, you can. If there's ANY position you can actually put any stock in their performance in a scrimmage, it's your front 7 and your OL.

I don't care if they get a sack or not(sacks are actually really overrated stats). But when you see Montravius Adams beat a guy like Lane Taylor as badly and as quickly as he did, why wouldn't you be able to put stock in that?


And they're definitely not just practicing footwork the first 3 seconds of a play. Hell, 3 seconds IS the play. But I'm talking about the team portions, the two-minute portions. Of course, they're playing competitively there. The run blocking is obviously pointless and tells you nothing, but the pass blocking? Yeah, they're going full speed there.


And the guys who are injured like Bulaga weren't out there. So yes, that would be the one area I think you can actually get a look at and actually gauge how effective the guys are.


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Offline  Re: 2019 Green Bay Packers Season Thread
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Posted: August 06, 2019, 6:27 PM Post
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homer said:
Spriggs waived.


Out of college and even through his first year, I thought he was going to be a solid lineman. Man, that ended poorly.


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Offline  Re: 2019 Green Bay Packers Season Thread
#13

Posted: August 06, 2019, 7:25 PM Post
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Has their been any talk about moving Tony Brown to Safety?


I really doubt they'd do that. They're really no need to. He's extremely athletic and has all the physical tools to play CB. I'd say being a Corner is akin to be a starting pitcher. You only get moved to safety(or the pen) if you can't hack it at your current position. Given that Brown's a guy who can run a sub 4.4 40, isn't real physical and has been getting work with the 1st unit, I doubt they'd want to play him at safety.

There's also the fact that despite scoring a 31 on the Wonderlic, he apparently doesn't pick up schemes very quickly. That comes from him, so I'm not picking on him and I wouldn't know. He likely would have been drafted if not for the stupid failed drug tests(of which there were at least 3) and the on-field mental errors which he dealt with both at 'Bama and last year. But he's working with Tramon, he seems like he's maturing and he has a ton of natural ability.

I don't think there's any question you're right about his ball-hawking ability and how explosive he is though. They apparently really like Savage, Amos, Greene and if they were to move someone to safety or play them in both places, I'd think Josh Jackson would be a more likely candidate. He's far more physical, he lacks the ideal speed to play outside. And then obviously Tramon could play FS as he did last year. One of the benefits of having Amos out there is that you know you can put him at Free or Strong safety and he's going to know where to be. You absolutely have to have that player who can get the secondary in position.

As for the defense in general, can almost guarantee they'll be better. But these days its all about red zone defense, getting turnovers, giving up big plays, and 3rd down defense. Probably in that order. How well they do in those areas will be the difference between a good defense and a great one.


I'd probably put turnovers atop the list. Remember in the early 2000's when we had Ed Donatell as our DC before he was the scapegoat for the infamous 4th and 26 Freddie Mitchell play, our team was always among the league leaders in forced turnovers. We had some talent on defense, but not a lot. He just played a real bend, don't break style of defense and it resulted in us giving up a ton of yards but then getting a ton of turnovers.

The fact that we had the best running back(arguably) in franchise history and an elite OL really nullified Favre's proclivity to turn the ball over.

But whatever order you want to put them in, it's hard to argue. If you're holding guys to 3 points every time down, you're going to lose to a Rodgers led team. If you're forcing turnovers, same. If you're getting off the field on 3rd downs, same.

The ONLY real area the Packers have been good at in recent years is the short-yardage run defense. They've been able to stack teams up in short-yardage situations, but they've been unable to create turnovers, get pressure and they sure haven't been able to get off the field on 3rd down.

O line is the only group that concerns me.


I think it's really as simple as Bulaga. If he's healthy, or relatively healthy, the Packers have a stacked OL. If he's not, there are question marks.

We keep hearing about some of their tackles, how good Light has looked and how he's probably earned a spot. de Beer looks like he could be a capable tackle. I think Adam Pankey is going to be a long time starter in this league and I think he can play all over the place. And then of course you have Billy Turner who they signed, presumably in part because he's a backup tackle.


But as things stand now a starting OL of Bakh, Bulaga, Linsley and then two of Jenkins, Turner, Taylor, McCray, Madison, whoever wins the two jobs at guard, that should be as good of an all-around OL as we've had since we had Clifton, Tauscher, and company.

It's deep, they MUST believe Jenkins is going to be an immediate starter and he should be if you pick him as high as they did, so that'd leave one spot left for a lot of talented guys. And while Pankey and McCray may not have looked great last year, remember how bad Lang looked at times early on? Same with Sitton? The majority of the fan bases wanted both of them gone.

There will be some real tough cuts this year, seems like its been a few years since that was the case.



Well, as fans who really pay close attention, it's a yearly thing, but I think you're right, this year they're likely to have to cut some guys who are certainly going to make other teams 54 man rosters.

I just listed the depth at guard we've got. I don't know if we've got any studs in there, but I think we'll cut a few who can at least be serviceable in the NFL.

OLB'er...I know this uncommon in the NFL and more a baseball thing, but should we maybe consider trading Fackrell? His 10.5 sacks last year was soo incredibly lucky based on his pressures and QB hits, but a long, athletic OLB who is young may bring back a decent draft pick and I honestly don't think he's as good as either of the two FA's we brought in named Smith, Gary. I like Gilbert better and then we have a couple of young guys who look impressive.


But this year is definitely going to be different with so many draft picks and free agent signings. I think we could potentially see some pretty surprising cuts/trades. Lane Taylor as I've mentioned, I think he's a good guard, struggled a bit last year, but hard to imagine the gap is real big between he and Patrick or any of the other options. WR'er, St. Brown looks like he's been bumped down the depth chart quite a bit.

I'll bet we see at least 4-5 guys we cut end up on another teams 54 man this year if not more.


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Offline  Re: 2019 Green Bay Packers Season Thread
#14

Posted: August 06, 2019, 9:40 PM Post
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LouisEly said:
homer said:
- Most of the receiving corps but Trevor Davis, J'Mon Moore, and Whitewater Jesus have been mentioned by name by coaches and writers

Kind of ironic that over the offseason these were the guys mentioned the most as getting cut (or wanting to get cut).



I thought Kumerow was the golden boy. I haven't seen many calling for him to be cut.

I wouldn't really "call" for anyone to be cut, but I'm pretty skeptical about J'mon Moore's future at WR'er given his terrible hands.

As for Davis being hurt or King for that matter, I kinda take injury's with a grain of salt at this time of the year. Anyone who's got any minor twinge in a hammy or quad is gonna be on the sideline and getting treatment.

Also, has Davis been that injured or has he just been that ineffective that while he may have been knicked up, he wasn't important enough to play with a minor injury? With guys like him on the periphery, it can be hard to tell if they're not playing due to injury or just ineffective play. With King, it's obviously been injury. With Davis, I don't know.

I do know Davis looked really good in the family night scrimmage. He went up and attacked the ball, going over a couple of Corners to do so.


My guess right now, assuming guys are healthy enough, is that we go into the season with Adams/Allison/MVS as our starting 3, Kumerow, St. Brown and Davis filling out the depth chart and then.

Well, Trevor Davis is hurt again, so there's that. That's been the knock on him ... can't stay out of the training room. If they keep him, I fear they will be disappointed yet again.


They're saying a "stinger." That's usually nothing.


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Offline  Re: 2019 Green Bay Packers Season Thread
#15

Posted: August 06, 2019, 9:42 PM Post
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PeaveyFury said:
homer said:
Spriggs waived.


Out of college and even through his first year, I thought he was going to be a solid lineman. Man, that ended poorly.



I was still holding out SOME hope that he'd figure it out this year.

I can't fault the Packers for taking an athletic tackle in the 2nd round, but it really sucks to look back and see Deion Jones picked just a couple spots behind him. He would look GREAT in this defense. Not much of a run stuffer, you'd want to play him with a bigger, more physical LB'er, but great in coverage.


Anyway, apparently, the Packers backup tackles have looked pretty good. So...hopefully Bulaga stays healthy. If we can keep both of our tackles healthy this year, our offense should be in really good shape. But the drop off from those two is so huge, we're gonna need to keep Mercedes Lewis on this roster just in case.


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Offline  Re: 2019 Green Bay Packers Season Thread
#16

Posted: August 07, 2019, 6:40 PM Post
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PeaveyFury said:
homer said:
Spriggs waived.


Out of college and even through his first year, I thought he was going to be a solid lineman. Man, that ended poorly.

Go back and watch the film of his combine workout and it will become pretty evident why they drafted him. It wasn't a Mandarich-like workout (Mandarich ran a faster 40-time than Jerry Rice), but his agility and athleticism was stellar. Looked great in position drills. Ran a sub 5.0 and put up 31 on the bench. Plenty of reasons to take a chance on him. He just didn't develop for whatever reason.


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Offline  Re: 2019 Green Bay Packers Season Thread
#17

Posted: August 07, 2019, 6:45 PM Post
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I wish the Packers would invest in an actual backup QB just once. I know that would be too much capital in one position. But it seems fairly likely Rodgers will miss time. I doubt Kizer makes the team being an old regime guy. There's always some hot no name out of camp but I would love to enter a season with a Ryan Fitzpatrick type guy one year.


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Offline  Re: 2019 Green Bay Packers Season Thread
#18

Posted: August 07, 2019, 7:32 PM Post
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OldSchoolSnapper said:
I wish the Packers would invest in an actual backup QB just once. I know that would be too much capital in one position. But it seems fairly likely Rodgers will miss time. I doubt Kizer makes the team being an old regime guy. There's always some hot no name out of camp but I would love to enter a season with a Ryan Fitzpatrick type guy one year.


I have a hard time seeing them cut Kizer. Maybe it's just because he's still got the highest ceiling, but he's got all the tools you could possibly need in terms of physical attributes. That's why I'd hate having to scout QB's though. It seems like it'd be impossible to test how they can anticipate, how they can throw into those tight windows, throw those guys open. I mean, that pass Rodgers completed to Kumerow was ridiculous. A backshoulder from the opposite hash about 30 yards down the field. That's a pretty telling sign that he really trusts Kumerow. But Kizer still has all the arm you could want, mobility and because he inexplicably left college at least a year earlier than expected, he's still just 23 years old.

Part of the problem the Packers have had behind Rodgers in general though is they haven't invested almost any draft capital in the position after Rodgers established himself as a star, in large part because they just couldn't afford it. They missed on too many picks in recent years and had too many injuries and holes on the team to be able to draft like Wolf did and take a risk guys of Aaron Brooks ilk in the 4th round.


But if you believe they do wash their hands of Kizer, do you think they go with just Rodgers and Boyle? They've gone with 3, especially since Rodgers has been banged up, but they've got a lot more depth now than they've had in a long time.


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Offline  Re: 2019 Green Bay Packers Season Thread
#19

Posted: August 07, 2019, 8:12 PM Post
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I just think Kizer is really bad, and he's still around because of his draft status. QB genius Mike McCarthy loved him and so I don't see the new staff as having any commitment to him at all. Maybe he makes it, IDK, but all those guys are just guys. I would just be really happy with anyone, like Fitzpatrick (I know he's starting right now for someone else) that has been productive as a QB. Someone you can hope to go 2-2 with if Rodgers breaks something.

I think if he gets clearly outplayed in the games, he'll get cut. Doesn't seem like they want to lose Manny Wilkins. He's probably another guy, but coaches fall in love with all kinds of weird QBs. My baseless guess is that only one of Boyle/Kizer is kept around. Wilkins stays on as QB3 or gets signed to the PS. If he gets snaps in the preseason and looks good, they may have to keep him.


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Offline  Re: 2019 Green Bay Packers Season Thread
#20

Posted: August 07, 2019, 8:26 PM Post
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LouisEly said:
PeaveyFury said:
homer said:
Spriggs waived.


Out of college and even through his first year, I thought he was going to be a solid lineman. Man, that ended poorly.

Go back and watch the film of his combine workout and it will become pretty evident why they drafted him. It wasn't a Mandarich-like workout (Mandarich ran a faster 40-time than Jerry Rice), but his agility and athleticism was stellar. Looked great in position drills. Ran a sub 5.0 and put up 31 on the bench. Plenty of reasons to take a chance on him. He just didn't develop for whatever reason.



Mandrich was a freakishly talented physical specimen even when you take the steroids away. I mean, he's not getting drafted ahead of the 4 HOF'ers that went in the top 5 around him in that draft...that historically great draft with Derrick Thomas, one of the all time great pass rushers and the closest thing to LT we've probably ever seen, Barry Sanders, arguably the best RB ever, Deion, arguably the best CB ever and Troy Aikman, an obvious HOF QB(though fans now will look at his stats, stats that would get most guys benched in today's NFL and downgrade him, not realizing how much the game has changed). I mean...Blake Bortles is better statistically than Aikman.

But anyway, not sure if he was actually faster than Rice as his 40 time has been used as a reason to not judge a player based on their 40, but Walsh had him at 4.59 and Gil Brandt had him between 4.49 and 4.55 in 9 times. Mandrich ran a 4.64...and he did it at 310 with probably a similar amount of body fat.

But back to Spriggs, his combine was similar to Lane Johnson's. Johnson ran a bit faster at 4.72, Spriggs was at 4.85...anything under 5 seconds is considered exceptional for a OL prospect. Spriggs was a bit stronger, Johnson a little more explosive, but they were similar.

I remember some saying he would be a better fit in a zone blocking scheme at guard or tacklecenter, it seemed like the only knocks against him were that he needed to add some weight and that he needed to improve his technique a bit, but all the physical tools you could possibly want. He was a guy with a ton of upside and you'd have thought worst case scenario, given his athleticism, you could at least play him at guard, put some weight on him and he'd be a elite pass blocker there.


You don't like to question a guys work ethic, but...there's really no reason a guy like him shouldn't have success in the NFL. 6'6, long arms, elite athletic ability. The Packers have a pretty good track record of developing offensive linemen and you had the best in the NFL to watch and learn from. Too bad he couldn't figure it out. This was his last chance and he'd been down almost all camp with a trap injury.


Another guy in a line of early picks that the Packers didn't get much production out of along with Randall, Rollins, Jones(thus far at least), Dahtone....hopefully they can get that going back in the right direction. Josh Jackson needs to get back on the field.


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