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Pitching staff adjustments?

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Offline  Re: Pitching staff adjustments?
#21

Posted: May 01, 2017, 9:44 AM Post
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Brew4U said:
Here is what I would do right now:

2. Send down Marinez and bring up Scahill.


I believe Marinez is out of options, so we would have to expose him to other teams. Not sure what the club thinks of Marinez long-term - but there would be a good chance we'd lose him.

Scahill would require someone getting taken off the 40 man roster. Again, chance you lose someone if that happens.


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#22

Posted: May 01, 2017, 10:10 AM Post
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reillymcshane said:
Brew4U said:
Here is what I would do right now:

2. Send down Marinez and bring up Scahill.


I believe Marinez is out of options, so we would have to expose him to other teams. Not sure what the club thinks of Marinez long-term - but there would be a good chance we'd lose him.

Scahill would require someone getting taken off the 40 man roster. Again, chance you lose someone if that happens.



I would then DFA Marinez and put Scahill on the 40. Seen enough out of that guy to realize that he is a dime a dozen in this league. Send him to AAA if he clears.


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Offline  Re: Pitching staff adjustments?
#23

Posted: May 01, 2017, 10:13 AM Post
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Who would take Marinez, I know I wouldn't bother if I was a GM. Expose him to waivers.


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Online  Re: Pitching staff adjustments?
#24

Posted: May 01, 2017, 3:36 PM Post
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So in June after they safely clear Super 2, isn't it time to bring up all of Lopez, Hader, and Woodruff and stick them all in the pen? Hader has nothing left to prove, he's ready, and Woodruff is pitching great in Colorado. Lopez too in Biloxi -- at some point, you need to just see what you've got in the guy and find out if he's still a legit pitching prospect.

If all goes well, this could drastically improve the pen quickly. I realize we hope to make starters out of these guys eventually but the reality this year is that we're going to have to limit their innings, especially Lopez, and pitching out of the pen is one way to do that while still contributing.


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Offline  Re: Pitching staff adjustments?
#25

Posted: May 01, 2017, 4:14 PM Post
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Location: Kenosha, WI
adambr2 said:
Hader has nothing left to prove


Really? Have you seen some of his starts? He hasn't been all that impressive. Very erratic.

He could improve on a lot of things in the minors still. Not saying I wouldn't call him up after Super 2 status, but saying he has nothing to prove isn't very accurate.


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Offline  Re: Pitching staff adjustments?
#26

Posted: May 01, 2017, 4:30 PM Post
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adambr2 said:
So in June after they safely clear Super 2, isn't it time to bring up all of Lopez, Hader, and Woodruff and stick them all in the pen? Hader has nothing left to prove, he's ready, and Woodruff is pitching great in Colorado. Lopez too in Biloxi -- at some point, you need to just see what you've got in the guy and find out if he's still a legit pitching prospect.

If all goes well, this could drastically improve the pen quickly. I realize we hope to make starters out of these guys eventually but the reality this year is that we're going to have to limit their innings, especially Lopez, and pitching out of the pen is one way to do that while still contributing.


Hader has done nothing but struggle at AAA. He needs to continue to refine his control. Honestly, he's not very close to the majors.

Also, all 3 need to continue to build on their inning totals, not limit them. I do think we could see Lopez and Woodruff in a month, but only as starters.

We could dramatically improve our pen by staying patient with the guys we have. They all pitched better as last year wore on, and will likely do so again.

The only reliever that worries me is Torres, he's older and his curveball looks like mush. However, he doesn't need to pitch high leverage innings, so he's fairly inconsequential right now.

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Offline  Re: Pitching staff adjustments?
#27

Posted: May 01, 2017, 4:32 PM Post
Posts: 551
Hader has been walking quite a few guys, but I think he has been working on his off speed stuff. Stearns made comments about this. Let's not forget, weather plays an important factor in the first few months at Colorado and various other places. I hear the commentators complaining about how cold it is and they are in the booth.


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Online  Re: Pitching staff adjustments?
#28

Posted: May 01, 2017, 5:28 PM Post
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Never Outhustled said:
adambr2 said:
So in June after they safely clear Super 2, isn't it time to bring up all of Lopez, Hader, and Woodruff and stick them all in the pen? Hader has nothing left to prove, he's ready, and Woodruff is pitching great in Colorado. Lopez too in Biloxi -- at some point, you need to just see what you've got in the guy and find out if he's still a legit pitching prospect.

If all goes well, this could drastically improve the pen quickly. I realize we hope to make starters out of these guys eventually but the reality this year is that we're going to have to limit their innings, especially Lopez, and pitching out of the pen is one way to do that while still contributing.


Hader has done nothing but struggle at AAA. He needs to continue to refine his control. Honestly, he's not very close to the majors.

Also, all 3 need to continue to build on their inning totals, not limit them. I do think we could see Lopez and Woodruff in a month, but only as starters.

We could dramatically improve our pen by staying patient with the guys we have. They all pitched better as last year wore on, and will likely do so again.

The only reliever that worries me is Torres, he's older and his curveball looks like mush. However, he doesn't need to pitch high leverage innings, so he's fairly inconsequential right now.


Don't really agree Hader has done nothing but struggle, his numbers are not too bad for Colorado Springs though he's still walking too many. I can see your point on building his innings, though many think he'll wind up in the pen anyway so I guess it just depends what you believe in that. I don't think he's that far away from MLB.

Lopez pitched winter ball, not sure how many innings he logged but I would assume that if he keeps up his current pace as a starter you'll end up having to shut him down relatively early.


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Offline  Re: Pitching staff adjustments?
#29

Posted: May 01, 2017, 5:42 PM Post
Posts: 5667
Location: Kenosha, WI
adambr2 said:
Never Outhustled said:
adambr2 said:
So in June after they safely clear Super 2, isn't it time to bring up all of Lopez, Hader, and Woodruff and stick them all in the pen? Hader has nothing left to prove, he's ready, and Woodruff is pitching great in Colorado. Lopez too in Biloxi -- at some point, you need to just see what you've got in the guy and find out if he's still a legit pitching prospect.

If all goes well, this could drastically improve the pen quickly. I realize we hope to make starters out of these guys eventually but the reality this year is that we're going to have to limit their innings, especially Lopez, and pitching out of the pen is one way to do that while still contributing.


Hader has done nothing but struggle at AAA. He needs to continue to refine his control. Honestly, he's not very close to the majors.

Also, all 3 need to continue to build on their inning totals, not limit them. I do think we could see Lopez and Woodruff in a month, but only as starters.

We could dramatically improve our pen by staying patient with the guys we have. They all pitched better as last year wore on, and will likely do so again.

The only reliever that worries me is Torres, he's older and his curveball looks like mush. However, he doesn't need to pitch high leverage innings, so he's fairly inconsequential right now.


Don't really agree Hader has done nothing but struggle, his numbers are not too bad for Colorado Springs


Because his fastball can dominate players at the AAA level for the most part. At the MLB level he needs the control because his fastball isn't going to save the day every time he gets behind in a count and needs a strike. Watching his starts most of his success is with his fastball and his off speed stuff is a hot disaster a good amount of the time. If they want to try him as a starter there is a notable gap between him and the MLB level.


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Online  Re: Pitching staff adjustments?
#30

Posted: May 01, 2017, 6:01 PM Post
Posts: 8909
By 'MLB level' are you referring to an average acceptable MLB rotation, or ours? [laughing]

Because I would bet he would be one of our best 5 starters right now. Not saying that I'm advocating calling him up and sticking him in the rotation right now.


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Online  Re: Pitching staff adjustments?
#31

Posted: May 01, 2017, 6:39 PM Post
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Picking apart Hader is pretty silly. Unless you have inside information to what he's working on, I wouldn't make any assumptions.


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#32

Posted: May 02, 2017, 8:55 AM Post
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I have no problem with Lopez coming up basically any time he's needed. It looks to me like he was just screwed up by Colorado Springs. Other than that, he's been a pretty good pitcher. We don't want to send him back to CS, he's already got a little MLB time, and at 24 he's not going to learn much more at Biloxi, so might as well bring him up first. He and Woodruff have pitched over 150 innings in a season, so while they may be limited, they don't have as big of IP concerns of Hader, whose highest total was 126 IP last year.

With Guerra coming back soon, barring injury we probably won't see any of these guys for a while, but when the time comes I'd probably go Lopez, then Woodruff, then Hader. However things play out, there are going to be some big decisions to make over the next few months, and I'd guess next year's opening day staff will look a lot different than this year's opening day staff.


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Offline  Re: Pitching staff adjustments?
#33

Posted: May 02, 2017, 10:49 AM Post

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monty57 said:
With Guerra coming back soon, barring injury we probably won't see any of these guys for a while, but when the time comes I'd probably go Lopez, then Woodruff, then Hader.

hader and lopez have both burned their 2017 options by each spending more than 20 days optioned to the minor leagues. hader will enter 2018 spring training with two minor league options remaining; lopez with one.

woodruff isn't on the 40-man (but will need to be added after the season ends to be protected from the rule 5 draft). if woodruff is added after 1 september, the club doesn't run the risk of him spending more than 20 days optioned in 2017 and burning one of three minor league options.


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Offline  Re: Pitching staff adjustments?
#34

Posted: May 02, 2017, 2:38 PM Post
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It isn't just about the young guys service times. It is about giving the current players a proper amount of time to prove themselves. Davies has looked better, Guerra will be back and need a spot, Anderson and Garza have looked good. Peralta and Nelson have both shown flashes and this is likely their last chance so will get more leash than they would if we were trying to compete.

For bullpen spots I think they are going to give Torres more time. Drake and Hughes are probably pretty safe since we traded for them this year and just haven't had enough innings to evaluate them. Barnes and Knebel and Feliz are obviously safe.

So there is one spot for someone in the bullpen and it is a spot where you are going to see erratic use most likely. Not the best spot for a young guy.


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Offline  Re: Pitching staff adjustments?
#35

Posted: May 02, 2017, 4:43 PM Post
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I predict that by August, Garza's gone, Feliz is gone, Nelson's in AAA, Peralta's in the pen, and Lopez and Woodruff are in the rotation. By "predict" I mean "fervently hope."


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Offline  Re: Pitching staff adjustments?
#36

Posted: May 04, 2017, 1:55 PM Post
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I really do hope they move Peralta to the pen. He has had ample time to learn that change up to neutralize lefties and it just hasn't happened. Lefties have a career .827 OPS off of him, this year it is 1.061.


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#37

Posted: May 04, 2017, 2:12 PM Post
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Ennder said:
I really do hope they move Peralta to the pen. He has had ample time to learn that change up to neutralize lefties and it just hasn't happened. Lefties have a career .827 OPS off of him, this year it is 1.061.


This goes back to player development but he flashed the makings of a decent one back in A ball. He only threw it like 3 or 4 times a game though. I know his numbers wouldn't be as good in the minors if you had forced him to throw it says 15 times a start but he might have been better off in the long run had he improved it to even average or even slightly below average levels.

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Online  Re: Pitching staff adjustments?
#38

Posted: May 04, 2017, 2:29 PM Post
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Wily should start throwing the splitter as well. Toss that thing to lefties and see if you have some success.


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Offline  Re: Pitching staff adjustments?
#39

Posted: May 05, 2017, 9:27 AM Post
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My guess is around June 1st we're gonna start to see some scrambling and shuffling of rosters all throughout the organization.

If Nelson continues to struggle, I think his chances are going to be pretty used up. He'll get the Jungmann/Peralta treatment and get a chance to work on some stuff in AA or AAA.

That leaves Guerra, Davies, Garza, Anderson, and Peralta. I really don't disagree that sending Peralta to the bullpen seems like a solid idea to regain some value on him if he can't stick in the rotation, but I'm not willing to give up on his rotation chances yet. But that could change by June 1st. Either way, I don't see him getting sent back down again (not even sure if he has options remaining?).

Garza's days in Milwaukee are likely numbered, but it sure would be nice if we could move him for just a little something rather than just having to cut him, especially since he's pitching well enough so far that cutting him would look pretty stupid.

By the ASB I'd like to see a rotation of Guerra/Davies/Anderson/Lopez given a shot with a revolving 5th door on some of the guys who deserve a chance (Burgos, Espino, Wilkerson). That said, if Woodruff keeps going like he's going, I'm not sure they can stop him from stealing that spot outright.


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Offline  Re: Pitching staff adjustments?
#40

Posted: May 05, 2017, 9:41 AM Post
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I wish we can get something for Garza


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