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corey knebel sets single season k streak relief record

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Offline  Re: corey knebel closing in on k streak relief record
#21

Posted: June 16, 2017, 10:25 AM Post
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bjkrautk said:
Am I the only person who doesn't really care if Knebel gets a strikeout every outing?

It's nice, but I wouldn't want him pitching to the record, rather than just focusing on getting hitters out and preserving leads in winnable games.

It doesn't look like he is. If he were pitching just to get strikeouts, there would be more nibbling and therefore more walks. Knebel is attacking hitters, getting ahead and putting them away. His stuff is good enough that he is getting a good number of strikeouts. The combination is exactly what you want in a closer.


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Offline  Re: corey knebel closing in on k streak relief record
#22

Posted: June 16, 2017, 11:06 AM Post
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A Swing and A Drive said:
Ennder said:
Baseball is riddled with meaningless stats that people worship.


I don't totally agree with this but if somewhat true than I feel like WAR (Wins Above Replacement) is being treated like the 2nd coming of Jesus.

Current baseball statheads put WAY too much faith in that stat, IMHO.


WAR definitely isn't perfect, especially for pitchers. The issue is there really isn't a perfect single stat you can use. WAR is something you go to because it is an objective measure with one single value so it is just easy to use.


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Offline  Re: corey knebel closing in on k streak relief record
#23

Posted: June 16, 2017, 11:21 AM Post
Posts: 5706
Hold the phone. You're doubting WAR??

Image


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Offline  Re: corey knebel closing in on k streak relief record
#24

Posted: June 16, 2017, 12:13 PM Post
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bjkrautk said:
Am I the only person who doesn't really care if Knebel gets a strikeout every outing?


Given how quickly this thread went to trades and WAR discussion... no I don't think you are the only one.


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Offline  Re: corey knebel closing in on k streak relief record
#25

Posted: June 16, 2017, 9:06 PM Post
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Location: Kenosha, WI
I care about this record in the sense that striking out people that much and that consistently probably means you are doing insanely well. Which is true in this case.


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Offline  Re: corey knebel closing in on k streak relief record
#26

Posted: June 16, 2017, 10:06 PM Post
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Ennder said:
A Swing and A Drive said:
Ennder said:
Baseball is riddled with meaningless stats that people worship.


I don't totally agree with this but if somewhat true than I feel like WAR (Wins Above Replacement) is being treated like the 2nd coming of Jesus.

Current baseball statheads put WAY too much faith in that stat, IMHO.


WAR definitely isn't perfect, especially for pitchers. The issue is there really isn't a perfect single stat you can use. WAR is something you go to because it is an objective measure with one single value so it is just easy to use.


I can appreciate trying to come up with a composite stat- and I will even use WAR for that purpose-- but its name is an egregious misnomer. Batting average IS actually the percentage of ABs a guy gets a hit. ERA IS actually how many runs a pitcher gives up per 9 innings. WAR is NOT actually how many "Wins Above a Replacement" [player] that a player provides.


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Offline  Re: corey knebel closing in on k streak relief record
#27

Posted: June 16, 2017, 10:09 PM Post
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What's the record that is not necessarily to start a season? Isn't that the record worth really noting?

But also doesn't span two seasons.

I wish whoever first noted this weeks ago didn't; impressive, of course, but so unusually focused on.


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Offline  Re: corey knebel closing in on k streak relief record
#28

Posted: June 16, 2017, 11:53 PM Post
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I think streak records are asinine. Production is what matters.


Edit - Case in point: During Joe DiMaggio's 56 game hitting streak, Ted Williams outhit him .412 to .408 in batting average and Williams' OPS was 43 points higher during that span.


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Offline  Re: corey knebel closing in on k streak relief record
#29

Posted: June 17, 2017, 5:57 AM Post
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502 to Right said:
I think streak records are asinine. Production is what matters.


Edit - Case in point: During Joe DiMaggio's 56 game hitting streak, Ted Williams outhit him .412 to .408 in batting average and Williams' OPS was 43 points higher during that span.



There is something to be said about being consistent. An example is DiMaggio's 56 games straight where he got a hit might've helped his team win more games than having 43 more OPS points over that same period. Not only that but 56 games is simply amazing. You know how I know? Because no one has come near it and probably never will.


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Offline  Re: corey knebel closing in on k streak relief record
#30

Posted: June 17, 2017, 7:59 AM Post

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35!


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Offline  Re: corey knebel closing in on k streak relief record
#31

Posted: June 17, 2017, 8:30 AM Post
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Ted Williams being awesome doesn't make Dimaggio's streak any less impressive. Both are remembered and talked about still today.


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Offline  Re: corey knebel closing in on k streak relief record
#32

Posted: June 18, 2017, 11:01 AM Post
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502 to Right said:
I think streak records are asinine. Production is what matters.


Edit - Case in point: During Joe DiMaggio's 56 game hitting streak, Ted Williams outhit him .412 to .408 in batting average and Williams' OPS was 43 points higher during that span.


I would agree overall but in the case you're pointing out .004 in batting average is not even worth mentioning and .043 in OPS just isn't that much for 56 games.


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Offline  Re: corey knebel closing in on k streak relief record
#33

Posted: June 18, 2017, 5:50 PM Post
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jerichoholicninja said:
502 to Right said:
I think streak records are asinine. Production is what matters.


Edit - Case in point: During Joe DiMaggio's 56 game hitting streak, Ted Williams outhit him .412 to .408 in batting average and Williams' OPS was 43 points higher during that span.


I would agree overall but in the case you're pointing out .004 in batting average is not even worth mentioning and .043 in OPS just isn't that much for 56 games.


I mean, it's been the difference between the board saying Keon Broxton is awful and needs to be DFA'd and him being the new Mike Cameron.

"I wasted so much time in my life hating Juventus or A.C. Milan that I should have spent hating the Cardinals." ~kalle8

Twitter: @MKEHiker
Website: http://www.mkehiker.com


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Offline  Re: corey knebel closing in on k streak relief record
#34

Posted: June 19, 2017, 6:28 AM Post
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Location: Milwaukee, WI
Mass Haas said:
What's the record that is not necessarily to start a season? Isn't that the record worth really noting?

But also doesn't span two seasons.

I wish whoever first noted this weeks ago didn't; impressive, of course, but so unusually focused on.

This link has 49 by Chapman from 2013 through 2014
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_M ... al_streaks


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Offline  Re: corey knebel closing in on k streak relief record
#35

Posted: June 19, 2017, 6:56 AM Post

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36! one away from tying aroldis chapman's major league record.

the brewers' next opponent for the next four games, the pirates, have the fewest strikeouts in the national league (505 to the brewers' league leading 687).


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Offline  Re: corey knebel closing in on k streak relief record
#36

Posted: June 22, 2017, 6:23 AM Post

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it took nine pitches to josh harrison, but knebel tied arolids chapman last night for most consecutive appearances (37) to start a season exclusively in relief with at least one strikeout per game.


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Offline  Re: corey knebel ties k streak relief record
#37

Posted: June 22, 2017, 8:43 AM Post
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Only thing you can knock Knebel for is inefficiency. When it takes 25 or so pitches to save a game he can't be used a lot. They could really use another reliable vet to close games 2 or 3 times a month.


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Offline  Re: corey knebel ties k streak relief record
#38

Posted: June 22, 2017, 8:54 AM Post
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Good for Corey. I hope he gets the record. Personally, it's not a big deal to me, but it would be a cool thing to be able to boast about.


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Offline  Re: corey knebel ties k streak relief record
#39

Posted: June 22, 2017, 9:04 AM Post
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JohnBriggs12 said:
Only thing you can knock Knebel for is inefficiency. When it takes 25 or so pitches to save a game he can't be used a lot. They could really use another reliable vet to close games 2 or 3 times a month.



Couple really good at bats last night by the Pirates took care of that. Wouldn't call inefficient.


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Offline  Re: corey knebel ties k streak relief record
#40

Posted: June 22, 2017, 9:37 AM Post
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JohnBriggs12 said:
Only thing you can knock Knebel for is inefficiency. When it takes 25 or so pitches to save a game he can't be used a lot. They could really use another reliable vet to close games 2 or 3 times a month.


I don’t know that I would call him inefficient. He is missing a lot of bats, more so than other top closers in the league. His pitches per inning (ppi) is on the higher end of the saves leaders in baseball, but the difference isn’t terribly drastic:

Rodney – 17.9 ppi
Knebel – 17.8 ppi
Kintzler – 16.1 ppi
Kimbrel – 15.8 ppi
Colome – 14.8 ppi
Holland – 14.74 ppi
Jansen – 14.45 ppi
Osuna – 13.89 ppi

But he also is striking a lot more guys out … almost at a Craig Kimbrel level, per the topic of this thread. (Ks per inning -> kpi)

Kimbrel – 1.89 kpi
Knebel – 1.77 kpi
Jansen – 1.71 kpi
Holland – 1.32 kpi
Osuna – 1.27 kpi
Rodney – 1.18 kpi
Colome - .93 kpi
Kintzler – .67 kpi

If pitching to contact is going to save him only two pitches per inning, I’d rather he keep doing what is making him elite and missing bats and I’d be hard pressed to call it a deficiency.


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