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Schoop news (Latest- Non-Tendered)

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Offline  Re: Schoop news
#81

Posted: October 30, 2018, 9:42 PM Post
Posts: 4945
I just see letting Schoop go for nothing in his free agent year resulting in him hitting 35 HRs with a mid 200's BA while playing solid defense at 2B - I frankly don't much care to use what Schoop did (or basically didn't ) do as a Brewer for 2 months to decide on his future with the team when the reality is that his playing time was hampered from jump street. He's a right-handed hitter who fares better against RHP than left, who was dealt to a team experimenting with a converted 3B slugger at 2nd who can't hit lefties at all. Schoop didn't get an everyday opportunity to play against RHP, particularly once Arcia came back up and hit well enough to start most games at SS down the stretch. 2019 sets up for Schoop to get his shot as the Brewers' everyday 2B in his FA year - I think it's a gamble worth taking for Stearns to bring him back if the price is palatable.

Schoop's offensive profile is terrible for a utility/bench role that gets sporadic ABs, particularly when he's put into positions that aren't necessarily his strength like he was down the stretch.

I don't think it hurts the Brewers at all to offer Schoop arbitration and essentially lowball him - the $10M figure tossed about for his 2019 contract assumes a normal salary progression based mostly on what he got following his 2017 year - this year's determination has to factor in a poor 2018 overall. It wouldn't surprise me for the Brewers to offer Schoop arbitration with a slightly lower figure than $8.5 Million, potentially go to a hearing if Schoop's side and them can't agree to an amount that fits the Brewer payroll needs, and if the arbitration panel awards Schoop the too high to stomach amount the Brewers could still just cut him 1/2way into spring training and only owe 1-2 months of his salary, I believe. Letting him walk without offering arbitration would be foolish, IMO.


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Offline  Re: Schoop news
#82

Posted: October 30, 2018, 9:55 PM Post
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Fear The Chorizo said:
if the arbitration panel awards Schoop the too high to stomach amount the Brewers could still just cut him 1/2way into spring training and only owe 1-2 months of his salary, I believe.


Really? That doesn't seem right to me...but I'm no expert.


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Offline  Re: Schoop news
#83

Posted: October 30, 2018, 10:19 PM Post
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Oxy said:
Fear The Chorizo said:
if the arbitration panel awards Schoop the too high to stomach amount the Brewers could still just cut him 1/2way into spring training and only owe 1-2 months of his salary, I believe.


Really? That doesn't seem right to me...but I'm no expert.

A player working on a non-guaranteed contract (arbitration awards are NOT guaranteed) can be cut on or before the 16th day of Spring Training are owed 30 days' termination pay.

So if Schoop got awarded $10M in arbitration, he could be cut and we'd owe him 30 day (or 1/6 or one month - all are basically accurate) of his salary - $1.67M.

http://m.mlb.com/glossary/transactions/ ... d-contract


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Offline  Re: Schoop news
#84

Posted: October 30, 2018, 10:25 PM Post
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There would really be no point in that because they would either allocate that money with the assumption that he's the starting 2B and not really look for a replacement. So you would basically piss away almost $2 million and back yourself into a corner with no starting 2B.

Cards' fans wear jorts.


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Offline  Re: Schoop news
#85

Posted: October 30, 2018, 10:34 PM Post
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I'm going to guess that we keep Schoop, but it's just a gut guess.

The front office obviously liked him to start with - so they probably are going to look at him and feel like they can get him to have a rebound season.

Just a guess.

Perhaps they will try and work him a bit -- get him to agree to a lower contract - say $8M - and tell him it's that, or get released. And I highly doubt he gets $8M+ on the open market. Maybe $5-6M and incentives. So he'll be amenable to the deal. The team then tries to get him back on track and produce like he did in 2017.

Now, we could go after a free agent, and there's quite a few guys that could be had for $10M or less. But most of these guys have their own warts. Asdrubal Cabrera (bad fielder, aging), Josh Harrison (injuries, mediocre 2018), Brian Dozier (mediocre 2018), Ian Kinsler (aging, mediocre), Daniel Murphy (poor fielder, aging, injuries), DJ LeMahieu (production outside of Coors is limited), Jed Lowrie (age, price tag might be too high), Marwin Gonzalez (years and price tag might be too much).

The good thing is that the Crew isn't being backed in a corner by Schoop. If the price isn't right and/or they just aren't confident in him - there are a lot of other options.


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Offline  Re: Schoop news
#86

Posted: October 31, 2018, 3:42 AM Post
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trwi7 said:
There would really be no point in that because they would either allocate that money with the assumption that he's the starting 2B and not really look for a replacement. So you would basically piss away almost $2 million and back yourself into a corner with no starting 2B.


Huh? Or you go to arbitration, then continually look for better options throughout the offseason via FA or a trade. If one comes along that is a better deal than Schoop (allowing for the 1.5 M buyout in March), great! If one doesn't come along there is no reason to force it or take a bad value because you have Schoop for his arby value.


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Offline  Re: Schoop news
#87

Posted: October 31, 2018, 5:33 AM Post
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Perhaps with a new hitting coach we can get Schoop to produce at 2nd and put Shaw back at 3rd. Jonathan can only get better....?


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Offline  Re: Schoop news
#88

Posted: October 31, 2018, 7:27 AM Post
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If they do offer arbitration to Schoop I just don't see much payroll space to do much of anything in terms of free agency. That would put the payroll at ~$115m before any other moves.

If they keep Schoop they probably need to find a way to move some salary. Thames or Anderson makes most sense since they're both a little redundant on this roster, but their contracts aren't immovable. Knebel possibly as a more darkhorse trade candidate.


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Offline  Re: Schoop news
#89

Posted: October 31, 2018, 7:48 AM Post
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I would think that they have a pretty flexible ceiling for their payroll right now. They won't spend money just to spend money but if something comes along where they can improve the roster at a decent value without crippling the future I'd have to think it wouldn't be a problem. Where that point is between a short term decent value and a mid-term to long-term overspend might be a little murky I suppose.


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Offline  Re: Schoop news
#90

Posted: October 31, 2018, 8:07 AM Post
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long ball said:
If they do offer arbitration to Schoop I just don't see much payroll space to do much of anything in terms of free agency. That would put the payroll at ~$115m before any other moves.

If they keep Schoop they probably need to find a way to move some salary. Thames or Anderson makes most sense since they're both a little redundant on this roster, but their contracts aren't immovable. Knebel possibly as a more darkhorse trade candidate.


Cots estimates $109,275,000. Attanasio knows this team can contend, so they could probably do that, but you're right that it wouldn't leave much room for anything else.

They probably won't keep three catchers, so one of Vogt ($3.75MZ*), Pina ($2M*) or Kratz ($2.25M*) will not be around. As you mentioned, Thames ($6M) is very likely to be shopped, and Anderson ($6.5) is another option. There are moves that could be made to free up enough cash to make some moves, and they shouldn't need a lot of cash if the plan is to use some combo of Woodruff, Peralta, and Burnes to fill out the rotation. I don't expect the Brewers to be big players this offseason, but I'd look for another Chacin-type deal.

The plan when trading for Moose and Schoop seems to be that Moose was a rental and Shaw would move back to 3B in 2019 with Schoop playing 2B. The question is whether or not his play at the end of the season is enough for them to change that plan and try to find another option. I'd guess that they'll stick with the plan and go into the season with an infield of Aguilar, Schoop, Arcia, and Shaw.

* means it's Cots' estimated arby number

"The most successful (people) know that performance over the long haul is what counts. If you can seize the day, great. But never forget that there are days yet to come."

~Bill Walsh


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Offline  Re: Schoop news
#91

Posted: October 31, 2018, 8:20 AM Post
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Their TV Deal ends after next year I believe. With a new one they should be able to command a payroll north of $120mil seeing as Attanasio isn't really concerned about maxing it out when the team it good. They may even have the ability to go up to $130mil range...but that is purely speculation. They are up for a new TV deal at the absolute perfect time.


Last edited by MrTPlush on October 31, 2018, 8:21 AM, edited 1 time in total.

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Offline  Re: Schoop news
#92

Posted: October 31, 2018, 8:20 AM Post
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Assuming the plan was to return Shaw to 3B, the question comes down to which guy do you see rebounding from a poor 2018. Do you take a chance that Schoop, with a new hitting coach and being more settled in will bounce back as a 27 year old and just 2 years removed from an All Star season, or do you take a flyer on Dozier on a short term deal who had similar issues to Schoop after being thrust into the middle of a hot race in a new league. Dozier's never been a high average hitter, but he'll walk more than Schoop with similar power.


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Offline  Re: Schoop news
#93

Posted: October 31, 2018, 8:23 AM Post
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JohnBriggs12 said:
Assuming the plan was to return Shaw to 3B, the question comes down to which guy do you see rebounding from a poor 2018. Do you take a chance that Schoop, with a new hitting coach and being more settled in will bounce back as a 27 year old and just 2 years removed from an All Star season, or do you take a flyer on Dozier on a short term deal who had similar issues to Schoop after being thrust into the middle of a hot race in a new league. Dozier's never been a high average hitter, but he'll walk more than Schoop with similar power.


I don't see any way they invest in a 2B only guy like Dozier. I would expect them to get a guy who can play multiple positions if Hiura is ready for the show. You can spend millions and then resort said player to a bench role later...it is such wasteful spending and doesn't help you out very much. It is a big reason why I could see Thames moving on somewhere else.


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Offline  Re: Schoop news
#94

Posted: October 31, 2018, 8:40 AM Post
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Location: Madison, WI
Agree with Plush. Assume they keep Schoop. With the 25 mil freed up from Moose/Soria maybe they can take some of that and buy a more reliable multi position guy to backup all over the infield who has good contact skills. Needs to to be RH (or neutral splits) to play 3B vs lefties and be able to play 2B if Schoop flops again, or I guess if Arcia flops and Schoop needs to play some SS. Wouldn't be the worst thing ify ou had to give a two year deal as well to have for depth the following year too after Schoop is gone.


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Offline  Re: Schoop news
#95

Posted: October 31, 2018, 8:41 AM Post
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Sorry if this was already mentioned in this post, but when do we need to decide whether or not we will be non-tendering Schoop or keeping him around? Is it soon?


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Offline  Re: Schoop news
#96

Posted: October 31, 2018, 8:45 AM Post
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Location: Madison, WI
madtownhawk said:
Sorry if this was already mentioned in this post, but when do we need to decide whether or not we will be non-tendering Schoop or keeping him around? Is it soon?


I believe it's early December unless I misread something, I looked it up a week or so back. So, in theory they could kick the tires on other between now and then before deciding. For example, say Lowry agreed to a 2/20 deal before that date, well then just let Schoop go.


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Offline  Re: Schoop news
#97

Posted: October 31, 2018, 9:21 AM Post
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I do think Schoop will bounce back somewhat. He pretty much has to or he won’t be playing baseball for a living in a year.

However at $10M that is really rolling the dice because at that number he can’t be replacement level, he has to be a run producer since he would limit any other move we would want to make.

We can move Anderson and possibly though less likely Thames for very minor returns if we want to keep a Schoop.


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Offline  Re: Schoop news
#98

Posted: October 31, 2018, 10:26 AM Post
Posts: 2090
MrTPlush said:
They are up for a new TV deal at the absolute perfect time.


I get we are winning now, so for that reason it is a good time.

But ignoring that, wasn't the good time a couple of years ago? Haven't tv ratings (so ad revenues) been going down for baseball in general?


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Offline  Re: Schoop news
#99

Posted: October 31, 2018, 10:44 AM Post
Posts: 4905
I see the Crew signing Asdrubal Cabrera to a deal - and using him as a complement to Perez as a utility infielder and a hedge if Schoop doesn't do well. He's a switch-hitter, some power, still puts up a 108 OPS+.

If he'd go for about $5 million/year, he'd be worth it.


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Offline  Re: Schoop news
Posted: October 31, 2018, 11:37 AM Post
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Sorry if this was already mentioned in this post, but when do we need to decide whether or not we will be non-tendering Schoop or keeping him around? Is it soon?


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