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Domingo Santana to the Mariners, Gamel and Zavolas to MKE

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Online  Re: Domingo Santana to the Mariners, Gamel and Zavolas to MKE
Posted: April 27, 2019, 2:58 PM Post
Posts: 18514
RoCoBrewfan said:
Braun is 36, made of cracked glass and Bubblegum and duct tape, and just isn't that good anymore. Most 36 year old ball players just really aren't that good. Every year he comes to spring training and he's like man I'm really feeling good this year this is the best I've felt in a while, and a lot of people buy into that and think that's going to be the year he's going to play a hundred and thirty games and suddenly have a 950 ops again.

Dude is our Pujols. He is done. He might get hot for a week here or there and have a nice stretch of games. But as far as being an effective regular player that time is done. He's 36 years old. Unless he gets back on the juice, he's done being an effective regular player. He's 36, he's past his prime. He's way past his prime. He doesn't have the bat speed or reflexes to be swinging that telephone pole of a bat he insists on carrying up to the plate with him every time he goes up there. He can't protect the inside corner and he doesn't have the bat speed to drive outside pitches to right field anymore.

The Santana trade is done. It is what it is we got a guy who will be a good fourth outfielder and a decent pinch hitter and an occasional spot starter. Lamenting that Santana is gone doesn't really bother me. He is one of the worst defensive outfielders in The Game and his defense is so bad it will offset whatever offense he provides unless his Ops is 950 or better all season.

Our best hope now is that Corey Ray or Taylor or someone else will take that next step forward soon


I think this pretty much nails everything on Braun. I think there's a group of people who still look at Braun through glasses tinted by his legacy and who he once was. To me, it's not the bat weight, it's not the launch angle, it's not anything within his control anymore. He is an old baseball player and the odds of him discovering the fountain of youth at this point and having a big rebound year are very slim.

I can understand appreciation for Braun's legacy. I'm not personally a huge fan, but I can understand it. What I can't understand is the hyperbole that we still see from time to time (he's still one of the best hitters in the game, etc. No, he's not.)

I agree that Santana, who has cooled off, is probably a .850ish OPS guy at best who shouldn't play in the field. In essence, Khris Davis with less power.

I saw some discussion about the Mitch Haniger trade yesterday and I think one of the ironies of it is that if we hadn't, we probably are comfortable enough to pull the trigger on the Braun trade in 2016. I do wonder who the two mystery 'prospects' were on the Braun deal and hope they were no one of any significance.


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Offline  Re: Domingo Santana to the Mariners, Gamel and Zavolas to MKE
Posted: April 27, 2019, 3:37 PM Post
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Is Braun under contract through 2020, or 2022?


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Online  Re: Domingo Santana to the Mariners, Gamel and Zavolas to MKE
Posted: April 27, 2019, 4:09 PM Post
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turborickey said:
Is Braun under contract through 2020, or 2022?


2020. Club option for 2021 which can be bought out for 4 million.


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Offline  Re: Domingo Santana to the Mariners, Gamel and Zavolas to MKE
Posted: April 27, 2019, 4:10 PM Post
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turborickey said:
Is Braun under contract through 2020, or 2022?


Image


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Offline  Re: Domingo Santana to the Mariners, Gamel and Zavolas to MKE
Posted: May 02, 2019, 8:03 AM Post
Posts: 171
Through games of May 1:

Santana: .284/.349/.470, 819 OPS, 0.0 bWAR (0.8 oWAR, -1.0 dWAR)
Gamel: .288/.391/.424, 815 OPS, 1.0 bWAR (0.4 oWAR, 0.6 dWAR)

I really hope we continue to see Gamel start regularly against RHP in place of Braun, at least as long as he continues to produce as he has so far.


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Offline  Re: Domingo Santana to the Mariners, Gamel and Zavolas to MKE
Posted: May 02, 2019, 8:31 AM Post
Posts: 4582
Location: Madison, WI
I saw this thread at the top and I assumed it was about him dropping a routine fly ball in LF last night. The recap on MLB network said he has 6 errors already. Obviously that's just terrible for an OF. I'm not a Santana hater by any means, I'm hoping he does well. But that was probably way more in the equation than most realize in the reasons they acquired two OFs last year to play in front of him even though he just had a 30 HR year with good OBP.


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Offline  Re: Domingo Santana to the Mariners, Gamel and Zavolas to MKE
Posted: May 02, 2019, 8:51 AM Post
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Gamel has more value to the Brewers than Santana would. He's the ideal 4th outfielder. He puts the bat on the ball, he can run and though he doesn't hit many HR, he's a double machine.


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Online  Re: Domingo Santana to the Mariners, Gamel and Zavolas to MKE
Posted: May 02, 2019, 8:55 AM Post
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tmwiese55 said:
I saw this thread at the top and I assumed it was about him dropping a routine fly ball in LF last night. The recap on MLB network said he has 6 errors already. Obviously that's just terrible for an OF. I'm not a Santana hater by any means, I'm hoping he does well. But that was probably way more in the equation than most realize in the reasons they acquired two OFs last year to play in front of him even though he just had a 30 HR year with good OBP.


For sure. You can obviously disguise shoddy or below average defense through the use of shifts and analytics, but that's a lot tougher to do in the OF compared to the IF. Positioning is obviously going to help a slower defender get to the ball in the OF, but there's nothing that can help them actually catch it. Domingo has the type of body frame that doesn't necessarily age well in the OF, too. He's athletic, but he's also huge. He's got a cannon of an arm, but that doesn't make up for defense that seems to be getting worse. He's a future DH I think.


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Offline  Re: Domingo Santana to the Mariners, Gamel and Zavolas to MKE
Posted: May 02, 2019, 8:59 AM Post
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Domingo should have been playing 1B from the day he was drafted. He is a horrible OFer, plain and simple.

I agree, if he continue to hit, DH is the spot for him in the near future.


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Offline  Re: Domingo Santana to the Mariners, Gamel and Zavolas to MKE
Posted: May 02, 2019, 9:01 AM Post
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Location: Milwaukee, WI
I enjoyed Domingo and like him but he just doesn't have a spot on an NL team. He is a 5th OF if needed and a DH daily. We just don't have room for that type of a player on this team whether he can hit bombs or not. Gamel fits our team and it was a good trade that was made by both teams.

If you're keeping track of this trade don't forget about Noah Zavolas. He's off to a good start in Carolina.

"I'm not as good as I was but in big moments I'm still the guy. I want that opportunity." -Ryan Braun


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Offline  Re: Domingo Santana to the Mariners, Gamel and Zavolas to MKE
Posted: May 02, 2019, 9:02 AM Post
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IIAY said:
Through games of May 1:

Santana: .284/.349/.470, 819 OPS, 0.0 bWAR (0.8 oWAR, -1.0 dWAR)
Gamel: .288/.391/.424, 815 OPS, 1.0 bWAR (0.4 oWAR, 0.6 dWAR)

I really hope we continue to see Gamel start regularly against RHP in place of Braun, at least as long as he continues to produce as he has so far.



Zavolas also doing well for Carolina: 5 G / 27.0 IP / 2.67 ERA / 26 K / 5 BB / 1.15 WHIP


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Online  Re: Domingo Santana to the Mariners, Gamel and Zavolas to MKE
Posted: May 02, 2019, 9:08 AM Post
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turborickey said:
Domingo should have been playing 1B from the day he was drafted. He is a horrible OFer, plain and simple.

I agree, if he continue to hit, DH is the spot for him in the near future.


Pretty sure I remember that the Astros attempted to move Domingo to 1B in the minors, and while details are scant, it apparently went horribly.


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Online  Re: Domingo Santana to the Mariners, Gamel and Zavolas to MKE
Posted: May 02, 2019, 9:09 AM Post
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turborickey said:
Domingo should have been playing 1B from the day he was drafted. He is a horrible OFer, plain and simple.

I agree, if he continue to hit, DH is the spot for him in the near future.


It was attempted...he was trash, obviously.

Amazing his defense has only gotten worse with time. He never was that bad with us...certainly not great...but not needing to be a DH bad.


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Offline  Re: Domingo Santana to the Mariners, Gamel and Zavolas to MKE
Posted: May 02, 2019, 10:44 AM Post
Posts: 2012
MrTPlush said:
Amazing his defense has only gotten worse with time. He never was that bad with us...certainly not great...but not needing to be a DH bad.


My biggest complaint was he was so tentative coming up on balls that they would drop in front of him where others may have gotten to them. Last year I thought he looked much improved in April/May on this particular issue, but the bat sent him down.


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Offline  Re: Domingo Santana to the Mariners, Gamel and Zavolas to MKE
Posted: June 22, 2019, 5:22 PM Post
Posts: 957
This trade was a bust!

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Offline  Re: Domingo Santana to the Mariners, Gamel and Zavolas to MKE
Posted: June 22, 2019, 5:35 PM Post
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I really like where we stand so far. Gamel is similar to Santana in stats like WAR, he has an option, and Zavolas has looked good


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Online  Re: Domingo Santana to the Mariners, Gamel and Zavolas to MKE
Posted: June 22, 2019, 5:40 PM Post
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I don’t think the Mariners feel it was a complete bust.... Santana has at least been productive-ish with the bat, despite being a DH-only type player.


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Offline  Re: Domingo Santana to the Mariners, Gamel and Zavolas to MKE
Posted: June 22, 2019, 5:40 PM Post
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I'm not mad that we traded a DH for a serviceable 4th OF who can get on base and play solid defense. If Santana was a superstar, that would be one thing, but he's a decent hitter who plays extremely bad defense. There was no place for him in MILW


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Offline  Re: Domingo Santana to the Mariners, Gamel and Zavolas to MKE
Posted: June 22, 2019, 7:27 PM Post
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PeaveyFury said:
I don’t think the Mariners feel it was a complete bust.... Santana has at least been productive-ish with the bat, despite being a DH-only type player.

You must be a politician ... that is quite some spin! Wow! [laughing]


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Offline  Re: Domingo Santana to the Mariners, Gamel and Zavolas to MKE
Posted: June 22, 2019, 7:28 PM Post
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RoCoBrewfan said:
I'm not mad that we traded a DH for a serviceable 4th OF who can get on base and play solid defense. If Santana was a superstar, that would be one thing, but he's a decent hitter who plays extremely bad defense. There was no place for him in MILW

I have no recollection of him playing the outfield like Eric Thames ... Santana is on pace for an all-star season ... Gamel will never be on pace for that, I predict.


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