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2020 Brewers Starters

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Offline  2020 Brewers Starters
#1

Posted: August 11, 2019, 8:20 PM Post
Posts: 107
Any chance the Brewers could get either Gonzalez and/or Lyles signed to an extension prior to free agency? In 14 appearances over two years for the Brewers Lyles has an ERA under 2.50


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Offline  Re: 2020 Brewers Starters
#2

Posted: August 11, 2019, 8:25 PM Post
Posts: 12552
Lyles?

Let’s calm down a bit.

There is literally zero reason to extend either of these guys before FA. You think there will be a bidding war for those guys? Doubtful, just pay them in FA. More likely we get a bargain waiting then somehow have it cost us money for not doing it in season.


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Offline  Re: 2020 Brewers Starters
#3

Posted: August 11, 2019, 8:37 PM Post
Posts: 4750
MrTPlush said:
Lyles?

Let’s calm down a bit.

There is literally zero reason to extend either of these guys before FA. You think there will be a bidding war for those guys? Doubtful, just pay them in FA. More likely we get a bargain waiting then somehow have it cost us money for not doing it in season.


Yeah, and while we waited for a bargain, Gio went to the Yankees for a few weeks.

If we can lock them down - and probably do it for a reasonable cost (say, $4 to $4.5 million per year), I'd do it. We have seen other pitchers (Woodruff, Davies) get hurt. Plus, Chacin will likely walk.


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Online  Re: 2020 Brewers Starters
#4

Posted: August 11, 2019, 8:58 PM Post
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Locks- Woodruff, Davies
Near lock- Anderson
Swing guys- Houser, Suter, Peralta?, Burnes?, Faria?, Nelson?
Young guys- Supak, Brown? File?, Bettinger?, Francis?, Rasmussen?, Belisario?, Jankins?
FAs- Lyles, Gonzalez, Chacin, Pomeranz

There's a lot of names up there and almost as many question marks. Somebody will be signed, and hopefully it's somebody more significant than Jordan Lyles.


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Offline  Re: 2020 Brewers Starters
#5

Posted: August 11, 2019, 9:12 PM Post
Posts: 4750
Oxy said:
Locks- Woodruff, Davies
Near lock- Anderson
Swing guys- Houser, Suter, Peralta?, Burnes?, Faria?, Nelson?
Young guys- Supak, Brown? File?, Bettinger?, Francis?, Rasmussen?, Belisario?, Jankins?
FAs- Lyles, Gonzalez, Chacin, Pomeranz

There's a lot of names up there and almost as many question marks. Somebody will be signed, and hopefully it's somebody more significant than Jordan Lyles.


Going on Lyles this year, and with the Crew last year... I think he may have unlocked something.

Giving him a deal on the order of three years (2020-2022) at $4.5 million each, with an option for a fourth at $6 million with a $2 million buyout is cheaper than what Chacin got.

As for Gio, I think he is worth a deal in the 3 years, $17.5 million range. Option for a fourth at $8 million, with a $2.5 million buyout.

I'd also lock up Pomeranz as a bullpen arm to replace Claudio - 3 years, $9 million.

That would give the Crew
Locks - Woodruff, Davies, Gio, Anderson
Swing - Lyles, Houser, Peralta, Faria
Young Guns - Supak, Rasmussen, Roegner, Bettinger, File
Questions (injury/otherwise) - Nelson, Burnes, Suter


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Offline  Re: 2020 Brewers Starters
#6

Posted: August 11, 2019, 9:46 PM Post
Posts: 8114
Oxy said:
Locks- Woodruff, Davies
Near lock- Anderson
Swing guys- Houser, Suter, Peralta?, Burnes?, Faria?, Nelson?
Young guys- Supak, Brown? File?, Bettinger?, Francis?, Rasmussen?, Belisario?, Jankins?
FAs- Lyles, Gonzalez, Chacin, Pomeranz

There's a lot of names up there and almost as many question marks. Somebody will be signed, and hopefully it's somebody more significant than Jordan Lyles.


We have a lot of competition...that's good. Most aren't candidates for regression, seeing as they're having bad or injured years. At this point, this is how I would rate things:

locks: Woodruff, Anderson
who should get the next look: Nelson, Houser, Gio Gonzalez (seems to say nice things about Milwaukee, the club, etc)
Needs to show something--could be in AAA, rotation, or pen: Burnes, Peralta
Bring back at right price or for depth: Lyles (I like how he's striking out more these last two years as a fit for our park, no matter the role)
Trade: Davies (he had a nice start to the year. His loss of velocity made him a novelty in April and May, but his ball doesn't appear to be moving as much and is getting hit hard)


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Offline  Re: 2020 Brewers Starters
#7

Posted: August 11, 2019, 10:49 PM Post
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Gio should be locked up now. The way that the market is, gio could be had for 2/10. Sorry, but Jordan shouldn’t be the quality we go for. Get gio as a backend, trade some surplus and sign a frontline starter to pair with woodruff. No matter who we buy the hitting stinks so let’s try some pitching for once.

"Did I ever tell you how I became a Postman Abby? I don't know if you'd laugh or cry"-The Postman


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Offline  Re: 2020 Brewers Starters
#8

Posted: August 12, 2019, 6:04 AM Post
Posts: 3060
Depends on which way Stearns/Attanasio decide to go:

A.) 1-2 year re-tool > this imo, is the way to go, but Attanasio/Stearns might not have the courage/stomach for it. Trade Yelich Hader Davies Cain Anderson for prospects.

Rotation: Woodruff Houser Burnes Peralta Suter Supak Bettinger

B.) Compete in 2020 > trade Davies

Rotation: Woodruff FA FA Houser Anderson Burnes Peralta Suter Supak Bettinger


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Offline  Re: 2020 Brewers Starters
#9

Posted: August 12, 2019, 6:46 AM Post
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Posts: 1753
I'd maybe go two years for Gio, and that a big maybe. I wouldn't touch multi-year commitments with any of our other FAs.


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Offline  Re: 2020 Brewers Starters
#10

Posted: August 12, 2019, 6:48 AM Post
Posts: 1052
I'd look to bring Gio back. Has pitched well, good to have a lefty, and seems like a good veteran presence in the club house.

In addition I'd also look at the FA market for another starter, I like Alex Wood but I'd expect a lot of competition. Maybe a not too expensive trade could be done for a starter entering his last year of team control.

Woodruff, Gio, Free Agent, Anderson, Davies would be the default going into ST. Houser, Suter, Peralta, Supak, Burnes, Faria would be their main competition. Sign a couple of NRIs and try to find this year's Miley. I like Houser and Suter the most among them right now. Burnes... I just don't know what's going on. He should be so, so much better.

If trading Anderson or Davies (i.e the only "expensive" pitchers in this group) would be needed to afford a good FA (In addition to the money spent on 3B, SS, bullpen, 1B) and maybe get a useful player back, I'd be OK with that. But I like the idea of having some guys we know in there. Davies and Anderson won't win any Cy Youngs, but if they perform in the vicinity of their career numbers that's a pretty damn good bottom of the rotation.


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Offline  Re: 2020 Brewers Starters
#11

Posted: August 12, 2019, 6:51 AM Post
Posts: 541
Woodruff, Davies, Anderson are the locks. Unless they’re willing to rebuild, they should bring in 2 FA pitchers: one cheaper (Gio, Lyles, Miley) and one to pair with Woodruff at the top (Keuchel, Ryu, etc.). There are a lot of FA SP this offseason and the other organizational depth can start in AAA or bullpen


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Online  Re: 2020 Brewers Starters
#12

Posted: August 12, 2019, 7:01 AM Post
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Posts: 10037
I think Houser is inching his way toward locking down a spot in next year's rotation. They'll have a lot fo depth going into next season. The question is whether the quality will be there.


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Offline  Re: 2020 Brewers Starters
#13

Posted: August 12, 2019, 7:10 AM Post
Posts: 1867
Location: Madison, WI
clancyphile said:

Going on Lyles this year, and with the Crew last year... I think he may have unlocked something.

Giving him a deal on the order of three years (2020-2022) at $4.5 million each, with an option for a fourth at $6 million with a $2 million buyout is cheaper than what Chacin got.



Lyles has a 2.43 ERA in 33 1/3 innings as a Brewer pitcher, but a 5.33 ERA in his other 834 2/3 innings. Really, giving a 3 year deal to a guy with a lifetime 5.22 ERA? Giving out multi-year contracts based on 3.8% of his lifetime performance doesn't seem like a wise investment to me.


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Offline  Re: 2020 Brewers Starters
#14

Posted: August 12, 2019, 7:27 AM Post
Posts: 12552
clancyphile said:
MrTPlush said:
Lyles?

Let’s calm down a bit.

There is literally zero reason to extend either of these guys before FA. You think there will be a bidding war for those guys? Doubtful, just pay them in FA. More likely we get a bargain waiting then somehow have it cost us money for not doing it in season.


Yeah, and while we waited for a bargain, Gio went to the Yankees for a few weeks.

If we can lock them down - and probably do it for a reasonable cost (say, $4 to $4.5 million per year), I'd do it. We have seen other pitchers (Woodruff, Davies) get hurt. Plus, Chacin will likely walk.


Gio Gonzalez was a bargain, as was Wade Miley. Stearns just opted to make sure every single potential young guy had a rotation spot and it imploded in his face epically.

Lyles would take your deal...because, who is giving him that much in 1.5 months? Gonzalez probably won't take anything that isn't close to what he thinks is his max potential on the market this winter. It is a weak SP market, if I recall correctly, coming up and he is a little over a month from hitting that. Not too much risk if you ask me to just wait unless you get a great deal.


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Offline  Re: 2020 Brewers Starters
#15

Posted: August 12, 2019, 7:56 AM Post
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Posts: 4471
Oxy said:
Locks- Woodruff, Davies
Near lock- Anderson
Swing guys- Houser, Suter, Peralta?, Burnes?, Faria?, Nelson?
Young guys- Supak, Brown? File?, Bettinger?, Francis?, Rasmussen?, Belisario?, Jankins?
FAs- Lyles, Gonzalez, Chacin, Pomeranz

There's a lot of names up there and almost as many question marks. Somebody will be signed, and hopefully it's somebody more significant than Jordan Lyles.


I would argue Anderson should be a lock before Davies. I would definitely try to bring Gio back. We should have a lot of young guys in AAA ready to come up. I hope we sign a FA starter but also at least one back of the bullpen guy to go with Hader and Knebel. I still believe our rotation would have been fine if we would have had the bullpen to allow our starters to only have to go 5 innings like last year


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Offline  Re: 2020 Brewers Starters
#16

Posted: August 12, 2019, 8:01 AM Post
Posts: 793
clancyphile said:
Oxy said:
Locks- Woodruff, Davies
Near lock- Anderson
Swing guys- Houser, Suter, Peralta?, Burnes?, Faria?, Nelson?
Young guys- Supak, Brown? File?, Bettinger?, Francis?, Rasmussen?, Belisario?, Jankins?
FAs- Lyles, Gonzalez, Chacin, Pomeranz

There's a lot of names up there and almost as many question marks. Somebody will be signed, and hopefully it's somebody more significant than Jordan Lyles.


Going on Lyles this year, and with the Crew last year... I think he may have unlocked something.

Giving him a deal on the order of three years (2020-2022) at $4.5 million each, with an option for a fourth at $6 million with a $2 million buyout is cheaper than what Chacin got.

As for Gio, I think he is worth a deal in the 3 years, $17.5 million range. Option for a fourth at $8 million, with a $2.5 million buyout.

I'd also lock up Pomeranz as a bullpen arm to replace Claudio - 3 years, $9 million.

That would give the Crew
Locks - Woodruff, Davies, Gio, Anderson
Swing - Lyles, Houser, Peralta, Faria
Young Guns - Supak, Rasmussen, Roegner, Bettinger, File
Questions (injury/otherwise) - Nelson, Burnes, Suter


Why give so many years? Guys like this just aren't getting 3 year deals in free agency right now. They'd all be lucky to get 2 guaranteed years.


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Offline  Re: 2020 Brewers Starters
#17

Posted: August 12, 2019, 8:10 AM Post
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Posts: 1176
Woodruff should be the only lock, IMO.

Brewers won't be making the playoffs anytime soon with this hodgepodge of mediocre talent in the starting rotation.

Let FA's Chacin, Gio, Pomeranz and Lyles walk. (sign a better Free Agent if possible)

Look to trade Anderson and Davies while they still have any semblance of value.

Put Freddy back in rotation and let him figure it out.

Wildcards: Jake Faria, Corbin Burnes, Jimmy Nelson, Adrian Houser, Brent Suter


Last edited by A Swing and A Drive on August 12, 2019, 8:21 AM, edited 2 times in total.

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Offline  Re: 2020 Brewers Starters
#18

Posted: August 12, 2019, 8:17 AM Post
Posts: 793
I agree with what most people have said already. Davies, Anderson, and Wodruff all appear to be trending toward a rotation spot (assuming all are with the team on opening day).

I think the Brewers will learn from their strategy this season by relying too heavily on the young internal options. Peralta, Burnes, and Houser could all wind up in the rotation next year but I think they will make a more conscious effort to bring in some cheap veteran arms. That could mean retaining some of the impending free agents like Gio, Chacin, and Lyles or targeting other guys. I think they can afford to wait out the market a little on the SP front though and sign guys who last late into the off season. They don't need to jump at guys early in the off season like the Angels did with Cahill and Harvey last year.

I think Nelson is probably a non-tender guy. Suter I like more in a swing man type role. Not sure on Faria, but he's out of options in 2020 and probably a relief/swing man type role.

Colin McHugh strikes me as a guy who might be of interest to the Brewers. Low velocity swing man type who might be undervalued in free agency.


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Offline  Re: 2020 Brewers Starters
#19

Posted: August 12, 2019, 9:24 AM Post
Posts: 12552
A Swing and A Drive said:
Woodruff should be the only lock, IMO.

Brewers won't be making the playoffs anytime soon with this hodgepodge of mediocre talent in the starting rotation.

Let FA's Chacin, Gio, Pomeranz and Lyles walk. (sign a better Free Agent if possible)

Look to trade Anderson and Davies while they still have any semblance of value.

Put Freddy back in rotation and let him figure it out.

Wildcards: Jake Faria, Corbin Burnes, Jimmy Nelson, Adrian Houser, Brent Suter


Your plan only seems make the rotation worse...which I give it to ya, that's pretty hard to do.

What exactly is your plan to improve the rotation? Because all you have said is keep Woodruff, let the trash walk, then trade anyone with a hint of value, put Peralta back in (downgrade), and mention (mostly) a bunch of garbage as possibilities. Your wildcards can't possibly be filling 2/5 of the spots (as you mention Woodruff in, probably a FA signing, and Peralta in your rotation). Seems, at best, similar to this year...likely worse


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Offline  Re: 2020 Brewers Starters
#20

Posted: August 12, 2019, 9:48 AM Post
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Posts: 1176
MrTPlush said:
A Swing and A Drive said:
Woodruff should be the only lock, IMO.

Brewers won't be making the playoffs anytime soon with this hodgepodge of mediocre talent in the starting rotation.

Let FA's Chacin, Gio, Pomeranz and Lyles walk. (sign a better Free Agent if possible)

Look to trade Anderson and Davies while they still have any semblance of value.

Put Freddy back in rotation and let him figure it out.

Wildcards: Jake Faria, Corbin Burnes, Jimmy Nelson, Adrian Houser, Brent Suter


Your plan only seems make the rotation worse...which I give it to ya, that's pretty hard to do.

What exactly is your plan to improve the rotation? Because all you have said is keep Woodruff, let the trash walk, then trade anyone with a hint of value, put Peralta back in (downgrade), and mention (mostly) a bunch of garbage as possibilities. Your wildcards can't possibly be filling 2/5 of the spots (as you mention Woodruff in, probably a FA signing, and Peralta in your rotation). Seems, at best, similar to this year...likely worse


1. Sign MadBum as Free Agent
2. Trade a combination of Davies/Anderson/Burnes and prospects to Orioles for Dylan Bundy

2020 Rotation
1. Brandon Woodruff
2. Madison Bumgarner
3. Dylan Bundy
4. Freddy Peralta
5. Jake Faria

Swingman: Brent Suter

Rotation Depth:
Whoever we don't trade of Davies/Anderson/Burnes
Jimmy Nelson
Adrian Houser

Prospects on the way...
Ethan Small
Aaron Ashby
Drew Rasmussen
Trey Supak
Zack Brown
etc.

Replace Moustakas and/or Grandal with cheaper options so we can afford to sign MadBum or Ryu, perhaps

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