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Kyles: Parra and Balfour (paraphrasing): Ready Now

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Offline  Kyles: Parra and Balfour (paraphrasing): Ready Now
#21

Posted: July 09, 2007, 9:18 AM Post
Posts: 51
With all the Spurling Bashing that I read everyday here, I'm surprised that everyone doesn't jump all over the chance to get rid of him.


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Offline  Kyles: Parra and Balfour (paraphrasing): Ready Now
#22

Posted: July 09, 2007, 10:19 AM Post
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to be honest, These two could be like the Angels calling up K-Rod. Both know how to finish batters, something Capellan has never done (thank goodness he's gone), and Spurling struggles with.


I think that's a problem the entire staff other than Tbow and Coco have. Sheets and Yo stand out to me as guys that get a lot of 0-2 and 1-2 counts only to have them end up full.

Consider me firmly in the camp that Balfour, Thatcher, and Parra could be very beneficial down the stretch or in the future. Without going into the detail I have in the past I'd take:

Balfour over Wise
Parra over Spurling (if it works out, he takes a long time to warm up)
Thatcher over Shouse

"You can discover more about a person in an hour of play than in a year of conversation."
- Plato
"Wise men talk because they have something to say; fools, because they have to say something."
- Plato


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Offline  Kyles: Parra and Balfour (paraphrasing): Ready Now
#23

Posted: July 09, 2007, 10:30 AM Post
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Sorry, I wasn't clear. I know he hasn't been walking many guys, but part of that could be because AAA guys just can't identify his pitches. He's had good control in the minors in the past, but it evaporated when he got to MLB. The last time he was in AAA he walked 16 guys in 71 innings. He then proceeded to walk 35 guys in 65 ML innings over the next two seasons.


That's not entirely true, he was becoming a pretty valuable pticher before the injury onslaught. I did my research on him back in May when I first started pimping for him on the minor league forum. While his numbers weren't earth shattering there was quite a bit of positive press about him.

I would think that after all he's gone through, he's learned to be a better pitcher, to pitch smarter. The guy has incredible fortitude to come back from 2 separate and career threatening injuries. I'm not willing to write him off based on 65 innings in 2003 and 2004.

Obviously I'm biased. Maybe I just love a comeback story.

"You can discover more about a person in an hour of play than in a year of conversation."
- Plato
"Wise men talk because they have something to say; fools, because they have to say something."
- Plato


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Offline  Kyles: Parra and Balfour (paraphrasing): Ready Now
#24

Posted: July 09, 2007, 10:36 AM Post
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Balfour over Wise

I agree with your other two, but not this one. Wise is working on his third year in a row of being at worst a good bullpen arm, and at best ('05 and '07, so far) an excellent one. I think there's only two spots - Spurling and Shouse - that could change hands (unless Gallardo were to go back down or in the event of an injury) and that they should go to Balfour and Parra. I like Thatcher, but I think he's third in line because he seems to be a LOOGY whereas Parra can work a whole inning, and when needed could work 2+.


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Offline  Kyles: Parra and Balfour (paraphrasing): Ready Now
#25

Posted: July 09, 2007, 10:48 AM Post
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Well, Thatcher regularly would pitch a full inning or 2 before AAA, so I hope you're not basing your opinion on what he's done in Nashville which is loaded with backend bullpen arms.

In my mind Wise would have to take the ball 2 days in a row and pitch well to be excellent. It's certainly possible I'm way off base, it's just early on he never pitched well back to back days, and without looking it up I'm unable to recall the last time he actually did pitch 2 days in a row. I find his lack of durability (for lack of a better term) to be very limiting during a 162 game season. Ironically I think he's perfect for the post season roster with the off days in the playoffs.

Of the 3 on the roster, I definately agree with you that Wise should go last, if he goes at all. He's been fairly successful, but he's been handled very favorably by the coaching staff in my opinion. He's never going to take the ball 3 days in a row.

In regards to the minor league arms, I'm not sure Parra fits the reliever mold, and from the sounds of it neither does the organization. Apparently it takes him quite a bit of time to warm up. Though it would probably help Yost's bullpen management to have to think ahead more. Let's just say I'm all for Balfour, and intrigued by Parra and Thatcher at this point.

"You can discover more about a person in an hour of play than in a year of conversation."
- Plato
"Wise men talk because they have something to say; fools, because they have to say something."
- Plato


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Offline  Kyles: Parra and Balfour (paraphrasing): Ready Now
#26

Posted: July 09, 2007, 11:01 AM Post
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His arm doesn't allow him to bounce back for a second day in a row. But, when he is given the ball he is good.

I know that Thatcher has pitched full innings in the past, but I would think that if the Brewers thought of him as more than a specialist they would be having him used for full innings at Nashville to see how he fares, because I think they place development of prospects over W-L record there.


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Offline  Kyles: Parra and Balfour (paraphrasing): Ready Now
#27

Posted: July 09, 2007, 11:35 AM Post
Posts: 454
As I reported in the game thread the other day, I saw Balfour throw 2 innings against OKC the other night. He pounded the strike zone with 94 to 96 mph fastballs, striking out 5 of the 6 he faced. He faced hitters 2 thru 7 in their line up. He got ahead in the count and then stayed on the black until they went down. He's got a real tight, late moving breaking ball too. It was man against boys. Thatcher pitched an inning each night I was there, striking out any lefty that faced him. He's just unfair to left handed hitters.


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Offline  Kyles: Parra and Balfour (paraphrasing): Ready Now
#28

Posted: July 09, 2007, 11:44 AM Post
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I didn't know Balfour threw that hard,i was under the impression that he was more a 91-92ish pitcher that was more schooling AAA hiters via command over velocity.

It must be kinda frustrating for him to stay in the minors given all the relief problems some teams have and knowing if he was in another organization he'd likely be called up by now and given a look in the majors.


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Offline  Kyles: Parra and Balfour (paraphrasing): Ready Now
#29

Posted: July 09, 2007, 12:02 PM Post
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Balfour is worth all but nothing as trade bait right now, his ceiling is as a middle reliever, and he's 29. He is good depth for the bullpen, and that's about it.


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Offline  Kyles: Parra and Balfour (paraphrasing): Ready Now
#30

Posted: July 09, 2007, 12:53 PM Post
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Balfour is worth all but nothing as trade bait right now, his ceiling is as a middle reliever, and he's 29. He is good depth for the bullpen, and that's about it.


We'll see.

"You can discover more about a person in an hour of play than in a year of conversation."
- Plato
"Wise men talk because they have something to say; fools, because they have to say something."
- Plato


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Offline  Kyles: Parra and Balfour (paraphrasing): Ready Now
#31

Posted: July 09, 2007, 1:00 PM Post
Posts: 99
i could see him being a closer candidate next year if we don't have Cordero. He was the twins top prospect back a few years ago but had 3 arm surgurys, but he is back now and its just really dumb to keep spurling up here and him down there. Parra and Balfour should both be in our bullpen right now.


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Offline  Kyles: Parra and Balfour (paraphrasing): Ready Now
#32

Posted: July 09, 2007, 2:38 PM Post
Posts: 10289
So Al an average reliever with major league success and on a minimum contract has no value?


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Offline  Kyles: Parra and Balfour (paraphrasing): Ready Now
#33

Posted: July 10, 2007, 11:13 AM Post
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He's 29 and has not pitched in the bigs for years, and is coming off surgery. AAA relievers with good numbers...that's a pool about 60 deep. Some are younger, some throw harder, some are true prospects.

If a team had offered us much for Balfour, he'd be either up or gone, as Doug does not hold back minor league vets from big league service time. A team like TB or DC should be calling all over looking for guys like this, and I'm sure they do somewhat.

For the most part, even veteran middle relief guys going to contenders at the deadline bring back a middling prospect. Balfour, until he proves himself in the bigs, is worth very little.


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Offline  Kyles: Parra and Balfour (paraphrasing): Ready Now
#34

Posted: July 10, 2007, 12:51 PM Post
Posts: 8704
Without seeing him pitch, I would think a guy who throws 95 with movement is a candidate for the closer in 08. If Cordero is gone, who else would you suggest is the front runner? Certainly not Turnbow I hope. Balfour could be a top of the list Power 50 guy, a veteran ML pitcher, or a guy coming back from arm surgeries. What does it really matter? If his arm is sound now, and he is throwing 95 with late movement he is a closer candidate-period.

As far as THIS year, be patient. Yes, Parra and probably Balfour will be called up but that may be now, or it may be in two weeks. Give it a little time to work itself out. Given Melvin and Yost's history, they will not hesitate to bring up players when they'r ready.


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Offline  Kyles: Parra and Balfour (paraphrasing): Ready Now
#35

Posted: July 10, 2007, 2:28 PM Post
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Without seeing him pitch, I would think a guy who throws 95 with movement is a candidate for the closer in 08. If Cordero is gone, who else would you suggest is the front runner? Certainly not Turnbow I hope


I think suggesting an AAA pitcher coming off of 3 arm surgeries as a front runner over a former all star who has almost pitched as well as the current all star closer is going a little too far.

I am hopeful that Balfour can help us. But I can't imagine he is nearly as good as Turnbow.

As for Al's assertion that Balfour has very little to no trade value - he is closer than we might think. Any team could have taken a chance on Balfour this past winter. Pitching well at AAA doesn't make you a future all star - plenty of players have reached that level and failed to move out.

HOWEVER, if we see a future in Balfour - he might be used as trade bait in that we KEEP him, and trade the player who he will be replacing in our bullpen. (IE, if he doesn't have enough value - trade someone who does)


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Offline  Kyles: Parra and Balfour (paraphrasing): Ready Now
#36

Posted: July 10, 2007, 4:58 PM Post
Posts: 12327
Seeing as how none of our relievers are completley stinking up the place I don't see any moves being made unless there is an injury. Same goes for all the players on the big club. The next move I see getting made is one that involves Hall coming off the DL. None of our relievers are terrible if they are used correctly. That means Shouse only against lefties.

Fan is short for fanatic.
I blame Wang.


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Online  Kyles: Parra and Balfour (paraphrasing): Ready Now
#37

Posted: July 11, 2007, 12:13 AM Post
Posts: 12292
"Seeing as how none of our relievers are completely stinking..I don't see any moves being made."

Not completely stinking is not good enough. Mediocrity is not the goal.

If you wait until someone is "completely stinking", you could cost yourself the season.

Man I've been posting on here for 5 years now and I see there is still a mindset that average is good enough.


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Offline  Kyles: Parra and Balfour (paraphrasing): Ready Now
#38

Posted: July 11, 2007, 12:29 AM Post
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I don't think it's always a mndset that average is good enough. In my case, I'm often anal about giving up a guy via DFA when a potential injury could put the team in a pickle as soon as a few days later.

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Offline  Kyles: Parra and Balfour (paraphrasing): Ready Now
#39

Posted: July 11, 2007, 12:54 AM Post
Posts: 3026
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I think suggesting an AAA pitcher coming off of 3 arm surgeries as a front runner over a former all star who has almost pitched as well as the current all star closer is going a little too far.

I am hopeful that Balfour can help us. But I can't imagine he is nearly as good as Turnbow.


Turnbow had a 6.87 ERA last season and has the highest ERA in the Brewer bullpen this season. Melvin is currently seaching for a top setup man to replace him in that role. He's been OK, but hasn't earned a promotion, and theres a chance, be it small, he could fall apart at any time, since he's done it before.

I like Balfour's chances of being a quality reliever, but this team will have too many leads to roll the dice on either of those too as its closer.

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Offline  Kyles: Parra and Balfour (paraphrasing): Ready Now
#40

Posted: July 11, 2007, 1:22 AM Post
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If these guys are as good as they say they are, bring them up now! We don't have much of a cushion in the division anymore and cannot afford to not be putting our best team on the field night in and night out. Bringing Parra and Balfour up in place of Spurling and Shouse would make this team better!


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