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Keston Hiura

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Offline  Re: Keston Hiura
#21

Posted: July 07, 2017, 6:15 PM Post
Posts: 3838
It sounds like he can barely play second. I think SS is definitely out and I doubt he has the arm for third.


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Online  Re: Keston Hiura
#22

Posted: July 07, 2017, 6:30 PM Post
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Location: Kenosha, WI
clancyphile said:
I wonder if Hiura could play shortstop or third... I'd like to see if he could fit across the field.


No...just no.


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Offline  Re: Keston Hiura
#23

Posted: July 07, 2017, 9:23 PM Post
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clancyphile said:
I wonder if Hiura could play shortstop or third... I'd like to see if he could fit across the field.


No, he doesn't have the arm strength to play at shortstop or third.


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Offline  Re: Keston Hiura
#24

Posted: July 07, 2017, 10:40 PM Post
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If Braun could play third, I'm sure Hiura could handle it.


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Offline  Re: Keston Hiura
#25

Posted: July 07, 2017, 11:24 PM Post
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It is overstating it to say that Hiura is just adequate for second. He is at least an average defender there. He's not a bottom tier athlete attempting to hack it in the field.


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Offline  Re: Keston Hiura
#26

Posted: July 08, 2017, 12:15 AM Post
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I think you guys are selling him a little short comparing him to Wade Boggs, Craig Biggio and Jose Altuve.

I think Honus Wagner is a better comp.


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Offline  Re: Keston Hiura
#27

Posted: July 08, 2017, 3:20 AM Post
Posts: 259
Greenleaf1 said:
If Hiura turned out to be as good as Ian Kinsler that would be pretty dang fantastic.

Still can't believe the Rangers traded him for Fielder.



I can. It really wasn't an unevan trade at the time. When Prince was traded to Texas he had missed 1 game in the previous 5 seasons and was coming off a two years run in Detriot in which he slashed 295/.387/.491 and an OPS+ of 136 while playing in every single game. He was also two years younger.

Kinsler was two years older than Fielder and posted a slash line of .256/.340/.449 OPS+ of 107. Not exactly a shock that Fielder was the better hitter, but it also looked like Kinsler was on the decline. Meanwhile the Rangers were absolutely loaded with middle infielders at the time. They had an all star at SS in Andrus and it looked like Profar might force him to move, not to mention they had Odor and Sardinas who were both highly touted middle IF prospects(Profar would get hurt and miss most of the year while Odor would start in 2014 and struggle).

Texas at the time was a contender, they looked like they had a deep pitching staff and it looked like plugging Fielder into the lineup would be the perfect fit.

Plus Detroit sent a sizeable chunk of cash to Texas along with Fielder(30 million).

Bottom line, Texas was on the verge of a WS, they swapped out Kinsler at 15 per and Berkman 10 million and actually cut their payroll taking back 18 million for Prince and the minimum for Profar.
There was little reason to think that Kinsler would thrive in Detriot while the games top prospect(and a guy who name was mentioned among guys like Trout, Harper and Machado) would end up missing two full seasons with injuries and that Prince would get hurt, come back and put up all star numbers again before finally suffering a career ending injury. Not to mention, at the time they traded Kinsler, there weren't a lot of teams that wanted him.

This was a trade that made a lot of sense at the time(also for the Tigers who were playing Cabrera at 3rd and needed to sign him and try to sign Scherzer in the next few years) and the Rangers who needed a big bat and tried to sign Fielder in free agency...and again believed actually had an upgrade in the minors...as did many others.


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Offline  Re: Keston Hiura
#28

Posted: July 08, 2017, 3:31 AM Post
Posts: 259
clancyphile said:
I wonder if Hiura could play shortstop or third... I'd like to see if he could fit across the field.



I don't think anyone really has any idea what he can do defensively right now. He was the DH all year, including for Team USA to protect his arm in his draft year. His arm is apparently healed and he's a good athlete.

Honestly though, my guess is if the Brewers are playing him at SS or 3rd base in the near future, things aren't going that well for him and they're trying to improve his value by seeing if he can handle those positions.

If his arm is healthy...and it sounds like it is, and if he's as good of a hitter as the scouts all said, he should sail through the system. Playing him anywhere other than 2nd/LF would only slow down that progress.

As to whether he could...again, nobody has seen him throw and really knows. A lot of people have opinions, but most of those are based on other opinions of people who haven't watched him play defensively in a while...and probably didn't even watch him play much then as he wasn't much of a prospect coming out of HS. So flat out dismissing the idea is just guessing(as I am). But really, the best question would be why? If he can be a elite hitter for the Brewers at 2nd base....all the better. No reason to make a blue chip prospect move.


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Offline  Re: Keston Hiura
#29

Posted: July 08, 2017, 10:08 AM Post
Posts: 789
Does anyone have a good sense of his arm strength when healthy? If we send him to left, is he as bad as Khris Davis' noodle arm out there?

He does have top of the order hitting potential.

I still like Isan Diaz at second anyway.


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Online  Re: Keston Hiura
#30

Posted: July 08, 2017, 10:14 AM Post
Posts: 6272
Location: Kenosha, WI
A Swing and A Drive said:
I think you guys are selling him a little short comparing him to Wade Boggs, Craig Biggio and Jose Altuve.

I think Honus Wagner is a better comp.


Haha seriously though.

On another note that Fielder/Kinsler trade was terrible. That looked terrible for Texas immediately and that is exactly how it ended up. Saying Fielder played so many games the 5 previous years is picking stats to fit your argument. The guy was fat and had a body destined for failure at 30. Texas lucked out that he got so hurt he couldn't play so insured saved them.


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Offline  Re: Keston Hiura
#31

Posted: July 08, 2017, 10:51 AM Post
Posts: 3035
OnTheBlack said:
clancyphile said:
I wonder if Hiura could play shortstop or third... I'd like to see if he could fit across the field.



I don't think anyone really has any idea what he can do defensively right now. He was the DH all year, including for Team USA to protect his arm in his draft year. His arm is apparently healed and he's a good athlete.

Honestly though, my guess is if the Brewers are playing him at SS or 3rd base in the near future, things aren't going that well for him and they're trying to improve his value by seeing if he can handle those positions.

If his arm is healthy...and it sounds like it is, and if he's as good of a hitter as the scouts all said, he should sail through the system. Playing him anywhere other than 2nd/LF would only slow down that progress.

As to whether he could...again, nobody has seen him throw and really knows. A lot of people have opinions, but most of those are based on other opinions of people who haven't watched him play defensively in a while...and probably didn't even watch him play much then as he wasn't much of a prospect coming out of HS. So flat out dismissing the idea is just guessing(as I am). But really, the best question would be why? If he can be a elite hitter for the Brewers at 2nd base....all the better. No reason to make a blue chip prospect move.


It's about adding options. If Hiura can play 3B, that means you can replace Shaw (directly) or Thames (indirectly). If Hiura moves up as fast as folks here expect, why not? If Hiura plays some shortstop, then the Crew has insurance in the case that Arcia's hot streak is just a flash, and he reverts to the sub-.700 OPS hitter he was before June.

If Hiura is as good a hitter as people here think he is, I bet he could be plugged in just about anywhere on the field. I think too big a deal is being made about defense sometimes. If Hiura posts Wade Boggs-like numbers, stick him at third, short, or even right. Just get his bat in the lineup.


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Offline  Re: Keston Hiura
#32

Posted: July 08, 2017, 11:01 AM Post
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Austin Tatious said:
Does anyone have a good sense of his arm strength when healthy? If we send him to left, is he as bad as Khris Davis' noodle arm out there?

The most definitive answer I have seen to this question was provided by colbyjack in post #122 of the Draft Pick Discussion Thread, LINK.

The part of colbyjack's post pertaining to Hiura's arm is copied here...

I've never seen Hiura's arm, but he threw 77 mph across the diamond in HS (which is well below average) at one of our events, so I doubt it got that much better.

The "event" he is referring to is a Perfect Game showcase event.

Based on that it isn't likely we ever see him on the left side of the infield.


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Offline  Re: Keston Hiura
#33

Posted: July 09, 2017, 2:40 AM Post
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clancyphile said:
It's about adding options. If Hiura can play 3B, that means you can replace Shaw (directly) or Thames (indirectly). If Hiura moves up as fast as folks here expect, why not? If Hiura plays some shortstop, then the Crew has insurance in the case that Arcia's hot streak is just a flash, and he reverts to the sub-.700 OPS hitter he was before June.

If Hiura is as good a hitter as people here think he is, I bet he could be plugged in just about anywhere on the field. I think too big a deal is being made about defense sometimes. If Hiura posts Wade Boggs-like numbers, stick him at third, short, or even right. Just get his bat in the lineup.


Please just stop. Please don't make this your next crusade and repeat the notion 1000 times. His arm is not strong enough to play on the left side of the diamond. And that's without the injury that almost put him under the knife.

Also, defense matters.


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Offline  Re: Keston Hiura
#34

Posted: July 09, 2017, 11:16 PM Post
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Hiura can't play SS or 3B. 2B might be a stretch to some people, but he's a bat-first prospect, and that IMO is not a bad thing (quite the opposite). And Jeff Kent is probably the most apt comparison I can think of.

Or Rogers Hornsby...Honus Wagner is probably a little too ambitious [smile].


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Offline  Re: Keston Hiura
#35

Posted: July 10, 2017, 2:03 AM Post
Posts: 7220
MrTPlush said:
A Swing and A Drive said:
I think you guys are selling him a little short comparing him to Wade Boggs, Craig Biggio and Jose Altuve.

I think Honus Wagner is a better comp.


Haha seriously though.

On another note that Fielder/Kinsler trade was terrible. That looked terrible for Texas immediately and that is exactly how it ended up. Saying Fielder played so many games the 5 previous years is picking stats to fit your argument. The guy was fat and had a body destined for failure at 30. Texas lucked out that he got so hurt he couldn't play so insured saved them.


I thought it was a steal for Texas at first. They got a younger, more productive player. His 2015 was a terrific year in a dead ball era. The Rangers may have had concerns about his weight (being the heaviest MLB player ever under 6'), but they had no way of knowing his spine would give out . Most would have expected strong seasons until age 35, but injuries derailed his career


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Offline  Re: Keston Hiura
#36

Posted: July 10, 2017, 8:20 AM Post
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clancyphile said:

It's about adding options. If Hiura can play 3B, that means you can replace Shaw (directly) or Thames (indirectly). If Hiura moves up as fast as folks here expect, why not? If Hiura plays some shortstop, then the Crew has insurance in the case that Arcia's hot streak is just a flash, and he reverts to the sub-.700 OPS hitter he was before June.

If Hiura is as good a hitter as people here think he is, I bet he could be plugged in just about anywhere on the field. I think too big a deal is being made about defense sometimes. If Hiura posts Wade Boggs-like numbers, stick him at third, short, or even right. Just get his bat in the lineup.


Why don't we just stick him in the rotation then? His bat will get in the lineup and we can replace Guerra or Davies..


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Offline  Re: Keston Hiura
#37

Posted: July 10, 2017, 5:26 PM Post
Posts: 223
Location: Milwaukee
Am I the only person that watches videos on guys? As I stated earlier he's a 2b and nothing else. He's a hitter; that's what he does. He's a pretty decent athlete and will be fine moving around and fielding; his arm is his biggest limitation. It's 2b and only 2b, which is fine because he's a 2b!! If he hits to his potential then it doesn't matter in the end.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FQzvUCHUxH0
(fast forward to the 1:50 mark) - HS

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hrE-sDccbJE
(first 25sec) - college


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Offline  Re: Keston Hiura
#38

Posted: July 10, 2017, 5:43 PM Post
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Humans Need Water said:
Am I the only person that watches videos on guys?


No

"Dustin Pedroia doesn't have the strength or bat speed to hit major-league pitching consistently, and he has no power......He probably has a future as a backup infielder if he can stop rolling over to third base and shortstop." Keith Law, 2006


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Offline  Re: Keston Hiura
#39

Posted: July 10, 2017, 5:45 PM Post
Posts: 223
Location: Milwaukee
homer said:
Humans Need Water said:
Am I the only person that watches videos on guys?


No

Could have fooled me. People here tend to never describe anything specific in the game (mechanically, etc) rather just cite analytics. Hence watching video. Or games for that matter


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Offline  Re: Keston Hiura
#40

Posted: July 10, 2017, 5:49 PM Post
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Humans Need Water said:
homer said:
Humans Need Water said:
Am I the only person that watches videos on guys?


No

Could have fooled me. People here tend to never describe anything specific in the game (mechanically, etc) rather just cite analytics. Hence watching video. Or games for that matter


Plenty of people in the draft threads commented on his video/mechanics.

viewtopic.php?f=69&t=35361&start=40

"Dustin Pedroia doesn't have the strength or bat speed to hit major-league pitching consistently, and he has no power......He probably has a future as a backup infielder if he can stop rolling over to third base and shortstop." Keith Law, 2006


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