LambeauLeap1250 WSSP


Test
  
Go to page Previous  1, 2  [ 36 posts ]  New Topic   Add Reply

Developing Players without the need for minor leagues

Author Message
Offline  Re: Developing Players without the need for minor leagues
#21

Posted: October 11, 2019, 12:58 PM Post
Posts: 4647
JimH5 said:
JohnBriggs12 said:
Minor League Baseball is entertainment and very popular. It doesn't exist solely for major league player development. It gives opportunities for many players not deemed as sure fire future major leaguers as adolescents a chance to play and showcase their skills in competition.


It exists as entertainment, but major league teams don't have to stock those teams with players. When 80+ percent of draftees don't ever spend a day in MLB, what is the justification for MLB teams drafting and signing them? What other business hires and pays hundreds of people knowing that most of them will provide them with no financial value in return?

And the question really is, are those hundreds of players really best served by sending them to remote outposts with minimal coaching, and having them play hundreds of games? Or is there a better way to help them reach their peak performance level?


Tell me this: Who makes it?

I'm not asking how many - I just want to know WHO.

You can't really do anything beyond a wild guess without getting those players on the field and having them play games.

Take the 2012 draft for instance. Did anyone think that the player who would make the biggest impact for the Brewers out of that year would be Brent Suter, a soft-tossing lefty drafted in the 31st round? (Mitch Haniger doesn't count, he was traded for Gerardo Parra). Clint Coulter and Victor Roache, the Brewers' first-round picks, were busts.

Did anyone think that 2010 32nd-round pick Jason Rogers would eventually land the Brewers Keon Broxton and Trey Supak? The former was a solid player for a few years, and got turned into three prospects via a trade. The latter's arguably one of the best pitching prospects in the system. The Brewers didn't even sign their first-round pick that year.

Or from 2015, there is Quintin Torres-Costa, who looks like a poor man's Josh Hader with a career 11.6 K/9 ratio. He was a 35th-round pick who arguably would have been on the Brewers instead of Alex Claudio if not for his need to have Tommy John surgery. Trent Grisham made the majors this year, but Nathan Kirby hasn't been able to stay on the field, Ponce was dealt for Lyles, and Demi Orimoloye was also dealt after not quite being able to put it together for the Crew.

If they didn't play the games, how do you find those contributors who were arguably overlooked by the scouts to some degree in the first place?


 Top
 
Quote   Reply 
Offline  Re: Developing Players without the need for minor leagues
#22

Posted: October 11, 2019, 4:50 PM Post
Posts: 1041
I’m perfectly happy with the minor league system. For one, it’s hard to truly beat the grind of the games they play day in, day out. Being able to go out there mentally as much as physically in games — and all the chess playing that goes on especially between pitcher and hitter — is hard to duplicate.

Second, there are prospects who come out of lower draft status and emerge from the masses. It’s hard for them to get a fair opportunity without proving it on the field.

Third, the minor league system is great for the communities where they play. In the summer, there might not be much else in terms of college or high school sports, and a minor league game can be a nice night out.


 Top
 
Quote   Reply 
Offline  Re: Developing Players without the need for minor leagues
#23

Posted: October 18, 2019, 1:53 PM Post
User avatar
Posts: 2243
https://www.baseballamerica.com/stories ... gue-teams/

I'm sure someone else will start a thread about this topic, but it seems to be part of the discussion in this thread already.


 Top
 
Quote   Reply 
Offline  Re: Developing Players without the need for minor leagues
#24

Posted: October 18, 2019, 3:40 PM Post
Posts: 104
It will be interesting to see if "team" names leak out that make up the 42 teams. From a current Brewers perspective, San Antonio has the population. Do they have the stadium? Do Biloxi, Carolina, and Wisconsin have the population base? Would they take into effect annual attendance at the locations?


 Top
 
Quote   Reply 
Offline  Re: Developing Players without the need for minor leagues
#25

Posted: October 18, 2019, 6:35 PM Post
User avatar
Posts: 1742
Seems Colorado Springs would be a prime target to be dumped, considering the "paper roster" for stashing players was its primary use, there are already two rookie-league teams in Arizona that presumably would even need to be cut to one, and you have Rookie league players in the Pioneer League traveling long distances that make it further impractical.

If MLB is driving this they'll protect the team-owned affiliates, so Carolina would be safest. The league is also travel-friendly.

Interesting that pulling in the St. Paul Saints was mentioned - if the goal is to get clubs more affiliates in their backyards it's good for Appleton. Wonder if they'd want to push those teams to higher levels due to all the AAA shuttling.


 Top
 
Quote   Reply 
Offline  Re: Developing Players without the need for minor leagues
#26

Posted: October 18, 2019, 8:50 PM Post
Posts: 586
Location: Milwaukee
The brewers have invested heavily the last couple of years in the minors, including buying the Carolina team and creating playing fields for the two Arizona teams. I presume the Carolina team will be unaffected, but if this goes through, they spent money on playing fields for just spring training. Maybe its not that big a deal, but I wonder if Atanasio has been busy talking to his accountant.


 Top
 
Quote   Reply 
Offline  Re: Developing Players without the need for minor leagues
#27

Posted: October 19, 2019, 7:05 AM Post
Posts: 45
balsamlaker said:
It will be interesting to see if "team" names leak out that make up the 42 teams. From a current Brewers perspective, San Antonio has the population. Do they have the stadium? Do Biloxi, Carolina, and Wisconsin have the population base? Would they take into effect annual attendance at the locations?


I do think major cities like San Antonio and Richmond could be affected. I think one of the many goals of MLB here is to force cities like this into upgrading with the threat of losing their team if they don't.


 Top
 
Quote   Reply 
Offline  Re: Developing Players without the need for minor leagues
#28

Posted: October 19, 2019, 7:14 AM Post
Posts: 45
ClosetBrewerFan said:
The brewers have invested heavily the last couple of years in the minors, including buying the Carolina team and creating playing fields for the two Arizona teams. I presume the Carolina team will be unaffected, but if this goes through, they spent money on playing fields for just spring training. Maybe its not that big a deal, but I wonder if Atanasio has been busy talking to his accountant.


The impression I got (and I could be wrong) is that the complex leagues in Arizona and Florida would be unaffected, and we would possible see expansion there. (Edit: I was wrong; each MLB team would be limited to one complex league team.)

I assume Carolina will be safe, but I don't know how interested MLB teams will be in affiliate ownership going forward if this goes through.


Last edited by LincolnDD on October 23, 2019, 4:35 AM, edited 1 time in total.

 Top
 
Quote   Reply 
Offline  Re: Developing Players without the need for minor leagues
#29

Posted: October 19, 2019, 7:40 AM Post
Posts: 12137
As far as the stadium issue, there's perfectly fine stadiums currently home to independent league teams. Schaumburg and Rosemont in the Chicago area are two prime examples. Instead of cutting hundreds of jobs in affiliated ball, why not put teams in those places?


 Top
 
Quote   Reply 
Offline  Re: Developing Players without the need for minor leagues
#30

Posted: October 19, 2019, 8:45 AM Post
Posts: 747
Getting rid of affordable, fan-friendly baseball options will only hurt MLB in the long run. Terrible development in my opinion.


 Top
 
Quote   Reply 
Offline  Re: Developing Players without the need for minor leagues
#31

Posted: October 19, 2019, 11:10 AM Post
Posts: 104
Five of the top 120 teams in minor league average attendance were in the Brewers system. Colorado Springs could likely be one of the 42 on their way out under the plan, with its run down stadium. Could San Antonio be the team headed to CHS Stadium in St. Paul? San Antonio has the population base, but Wolff Stadium could use some work.


 Top
 
Quote   Reply 
Offline  Re: Developing Players without the need for minor leagues
#32

Posted: October 19, 2019, 1:04 PM Post
Posts: 45
San Antonio would be a possibility. Fresno seems like another. I'm sure MLB has noticed how Fresno has become the spot nobody wants. The article mentioned the possibility of a team being demoted from AAA to A, and they're right there in Cal League territory.

Tacoma's , too, given their older stadium and unfortunate geographic location in relation to all the other teams.

Would have to think that the Twins would have a say in what happens in St. Paul. Sugar Land was the other indy team mentioned as an org that could be absorbed into professional baseball. I would guess that's Astros territory.


 Top
 
Quote   Reply 
Offline  Re: Developing Players without the need for minor leagues
#33

Posted: October 21, 2019, 9:25 PM Post
Posts: 12183
brooks_quichenick said:
Getting rid of affordable, fan-friendly baseball options will only hurt MLB in the long run. Terrible development in my opinion.


Reading the article it sounds like little to no cities would actually lose a baseball team if they want to join the ‘Dream League’. There is loads of baseball being played outside of the MiLB system anyway...independent leagues, semi-pro stuff, college, summer league. All of which are probably way more family friendly and affordable compared to MiLB.

I like the MLB plan, but it is a total nightmare when it comes to infrastructure and financials. I can’t even imagine trying to put these MASSIVE changes in places so soon.

One big problem, they want to make the lower level team pay millions to be AAA. How are they paying all that money for no real monetary gain? It may attract some more attention having AAA players, but hardly enough to offset the insane valuation increase imposed on them. I doubt they make these smaller stadium teams all build new ones their region may not support. By support I mean financially (AAA stadiums cost a solid $50mil) or literal support via attendance etc.

I think most of their concepts are beautiful, but to actually make them a reality understanding it effects many communities, people, and owners just seems wishful. This is an incredibly long overdue process that should have begun a long time ago.


 Top
 
Quote   Reply 
Offline  Re: Developing Players without the need for minor leagues
#34

Posted: October 22, 2019, 7:25 AM Post
Posts: 12183
balsamlaker said:
Five of the top 120 teams in minor league average attendance were in the Brewers system. Colorado Springs could likely be one of the 42 on their way out under the plan, with its run down stadium. Could San Antonio be the team headed to CHS Stadium in St. Paul? San Antonio has the population base, but Wolff Stadium could use some work.


San Antonio got the team and there were pretty good expectations of a new stadium to be done. With those plans getting more dismal by the day I would expect MLB to move the team if they won't build the stadium. A big part of MLBs wishes is to have better facilities.


 Top
 
Quote   Reply 
Offline  Re: Developing Players without the need for minor leagues
#35

Posted: November 16, 2019, 4:34 PM Post
Posts: 45
List of the 42 is out via the New York Times. They don't say where they got the names. As expected, Colorado Springs/Rocky Mountain is gone, and every team from the Pioneer League is on the list.

No other Brewers affiliate is listed. In other Brewers affiliates leagues: Southern League would lose Chattanooga and Jackson. Three teams from the Midwest League are out, Burlington, Clinton and Quad Cities. Frederick from the Carolina League goes. Our former FSL Brevard County team (now the Braves' Florida Fire Frogs) gets the axe, too.

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/11/16/spor ... posal.html


 Top
 
Quote   Reply 
Offline  Re: Developing Players without the need for minor leagues
#36

Posted: November 16, 2019, 10:55 PM Post
Posts: 4647
Honestly...

I think the Brewers are fools to go along with this sort of cut. If anything, they should expand their minor-league system.

Two DSL teams
Two rookie-level teams.
A R+ team
A short-season A team
A full-season A team
A full-season A+ team
A AA team
A AAA team

Plus, create baseball academies in Australia, South Korea, Taiwan, and Japan.

Build something extremely extensive...

I wonder if it would be possible for them to also maybe buy part owner-ship of some independent league teams, like the Milwaukee Milkmen...


 Top
 
Quote   Reply 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Go to page Previous  1, 2  [ 36 posts ]  New Topic   Add Reply
Test
  


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 11 guests

You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search this forum (phpBB search):
Jump to:  
Search entire board (Google search):
Google
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group
Test