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DDSM (Double Diamond Sports Management)

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Offline  Re: DDSM (Double Diamond Sports Management)
Posted: January 22, 2018, 4:40 PM Post
Posts: 618
http://natsgm.com/2018/01/22/the-joshua ... bitration/


Best episode ever.


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Offline  Re: DDSM (Double Diamond Sports Management)
Posted: January 22, 2018, 6:47 PM Post
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agent39 said:
http://natsgm.com/2018/01/22/the-joshua-kusnick-experience-22-lets-talk-about-arbitration/

Best episode ever.


"THE Joshua Kusnick Experience #22 continues with our new format and this episode responds directly to a question from the audience – Why do some players go to arbitration and others choose to sign long-term?

The conversation begins with Josh briefly explaining the arbitration process, the expense of preparing for the hearing and the cost/benefit analysis of signing a contract verses going to a hearing. Next Josh specifically discusses his client Jeremy Jeffress, the mechanics behind his contract he signed a few months ago and the thought process behind him signing this deal before reaching arbitration. This show gives a tremendous insight into the work agents do for their clients."


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Offline  Re: DDSM (Double Diamond Sports Management)
Posted: January 23, 2018, 9:16 AM Post
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Somehow I didn't know this podcast existed. I listened to the JJ/Arbitration episode this morning, and it's excellent. I've always enjoyed (and appreciated) Josh's contributions to this site, but this podcast was even better. It also solidified JJ as one of my favorite Brewers.


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Offline  Re: DDSM (Double Diamond Sports Management)
Posted: January 23, 2018, 3:28 PM Post
Posts: 618
chuckiehacks said:
Somehow I didn't know this podcast existed. I listened to the JJ/Arbitration episode this morning, and it's excellent. I've always enjoyed (and appreciated) Josh's contributions to this site, but this podcast was even better. It also solidified JJ as one of my favorite Brewers.




I prefer new format!


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Offline  Re: DDSM (Double Diamond Sports Management)
Posted: February 04, 2018, 12:56 AM Post
Posts: 618
https://twitter.com/JoshuaKusnick/statu ... 6358635523


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Offline  Re: DDSM (Double Diamond Sports Management)
Posted: February 04, 2018, 9:37 AM Post
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Wow, there was so much stupid in that thread I thought I had wandered into a political discussion.... I really feel this has to be addressed from the bottom up, not the top down...the biggest issue in baseball lies with the most prevalent group oddly - the lower level minors and minors in general...Until that massive salary squashing is broached the serious money should not be foremost in the argument


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Offline  Re: DDSM (Double Diamond Sports Management)
Posted: February 04, 2018, 10:06 AM Post
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Josh, why is it that the logjam at the top has seemingly trickled all the way down to MiLB deals and less expensive free agents?

I'm of two minds about this offseason, because on the one hand I always support the players over the owners, but on the other hand I think the freeze at the top is not surprising given that players like Eric Hosmer and J.D. Martinez who are trying to get $150,000,000 deals are simply not, ahem, all that good. Can't figure out why so many other free agents haven't signed though. It's not like most teams are waiting to see what happens with Hosmer to figure out whether to commit money.


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Online  Re: DDSM (Double Diamond Sports Management)
Posted: February 04, 2018, 10:27 AM Post
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molitor fan said:
Wow, there was so much stupid in that thread I thought I had wandered into a political discussion.... I really feel this has to be addressed from the bottom up, not the top down...the biggest issue in baseball lies with the most prevalent group oddly - the lower level minors and minors in general...Until that massive salary squashing is broached the serious money should not be foremost in the argument


I agree players should be paid more earlier but do you really think that they are then going to ask for less when they become free agents? Because they won't. The incredibly flawed free agent class this year is throwing a hissy fit because 2nd tier players aren't getting paid like superstars. Wait till next year when teams are throwing brinks trucks full of cash at future hall of famers and then we'll see where the complaining is coming from.


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Offline  Re: DDSM (Double Diamond Sports Management)
Posted: February 04, 2018, 2:20 PM Post
Posts: 618
I have a 15 minute audio clip for me on MLB network today explaining my thoughts on everything arguing with Jim Bowden


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Offline  Re: DDSM (Double Diamond Sports Management)
Posted: February 04, 2018, 9:49 PM Post
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agent39 said:
I have a 15 minute audio clip for me on MLB network today explaining my thoughts on everything arguing with Jim Bowden


Where can one listen to that clip?? I for one would love to take a listen...


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Offline  Re: DDSM (Double Diamond Sports Management)
Posted: February 05, 2018, 11:32 AM Post
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Josh, to what extent might this be a function of the financial rules of the game changing? With the installation of additional penalties for going over the soft salary cap comes additional risk to teams if high salary players become injured or perform poorly because the salaries are guaranteed. Teams don't want to be saddled with the next Josh Hamilton contract, or the next Carl Crawford contract, or the next Pablo Sandoval contract, or the next Albert Pujols contract, etc., because those guys flame out long before their contract is up. Teams are understanding that players performing well into their late 30's was more of a function of PEDs than natural ability, and analytics are showing that performance starts dropping off in the mid-30's.

If analytics are showing that long-term guaranteed contracts, especially those that go into a player's late 30's, are a bad investment... how do you argue with that? It sounds like (maybe it's fact, maybe it's fiction) these guys have contract offers but are pushing for additional years.


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Online  Re: DDSM (Double Diamond Sports Management)
Posted: February 05, 2018, 2:56 PM Post
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LouisEly said:
Josh, to what extent might this be a function of the financial rules of the game changing? With the installation of additional penalties for going over the soft salary cap comes additional risk to teams if high salary players become injured or perform poorly because the salaries are guaranteed. Teams don't want to be saddled with the next Josh Hamilton contract, or the next Carl Crawford contract, or the next Pablo Sandoval contract, or the next Albert Pujols contract, etc., because those guys flame out long before their contract is up. Teams are understanding that players performing well into their late 30's was more of a function of PEDs than natural ability, and analytics are showing that performance starts dropping off in the mid-30's.

If analytics are showing that long-term guaranteed contracts, especially those that go into a player's late 30's, are a bad investment... how do you argue with that? It sounds like (maybe it's fact, maybe it's fiction) these guys have contract offers but are pushing for additional years.


Decline is part of it, the other part is so many players start coasting after they sign their last big contract. Do you think Pujols is working out like he did earlier in his career? Have you seen him lately?...that dude probably works out one handful of potato chips at a time in the off season and gets paid $30 million/year.

The decline part is definitely real though, and it probably makes sense to revisit the 6 years of team control thing, and likewise competitive balance so small market teams can compete. The end result probably should be a salary cap/floor so players can guarantee themselves X share of the market while allowing smaller markets to compete. That won't happen for silly reasons, but that doesn't change that the system probably needs addressing.


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Offline  Re: DDSM (Double Diamond Sports Management)
Posted: February 05, 2018, 9:22 PM Post
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So i have to believe all 30 teams got smart w analytics while at the same time every player got greedy and every single agent myself included misread the market (i didnt as i feared this ie JJ signed)

No.


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Offline  Re: DDSM (Double Diamond Sports Management)
Posted: February 05, 2018, 9:23 PM Post
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https://www.reddit.com/r/baseball/comme ... _an_mlbpa/


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Offline  Re: DDSM (Double Diamond Sports Management)
Posted: February 06, 2018, 6:07 AM Post
Posts: 493
agent39 said:
So i have to believe all 30 teams got smart w analytics while at the same time every player got greedy and every single agent myself included misread the market (i didnt as i feared this ie JJ signed)

No.


I do love your willingness to interact with fans and the insights you provide, but I’m still not there on smelling anything fishy.
So we are supposed to believe that 30 MLB highly competitive executives and owners got together and said, “I know revenues are healthy, despite the fact that the overall value and revenue of our individual franchises are tied heavily to whether we win; let’s just refuse to compete with each other on high end free agents.” I mean I guess it could happen, but we’ve seen teams felony hacking each other’s intellectual property (Cardinals), bribing 16 year olds and shady trainers (Braves and Red Sox), and trying to blackmail a player’s amateur status (Astros) to gain an edge. Now they are all going to disregard their own evaluations of what a player is worth to artificially keep costs down?
I can look at the Phillies, Diamondbacks, Mariners, Twins, Brewers, etc and see baseball front offices are changing. I also see a market that has 3 pitchers coming off of Tommy John and a 4th with substantial decline trends in performance and see why there would be limited action. I don’t see a substantial, new, or any growing motivation for teams to collude.


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Online  Re: DDSM (Double Diamond Sports Management)
Posted: February 06, 2018, 8:48 AM Post
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The more the players and agents keep screaming collusion the worse their side looks. It's all about the 2018 free agents (Harper, Machado, Kershaw, etc.). Therefore Boston, New York, LA, and Chicago aren't out there driving up costs this year so they can have money next year for those guys.


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Offline  Re: DDSM (Double Diamond Sports Management)
Posted: February 06, 2018, 9:12 AM Post
Posts: 618
No it clearly isnt

1. How many guys will reach that market
2. How many clubs will be in in those bids?
3. The luxury tax is not a cap and is negligable when compared to revenues. Its ready made cover. Its in cba so that part is life. It doesnt mean both scenarios are not occuring.
4. Player revenues have only dipped year to year 3 times ever. All 3 times collusion waa proven.
5. Clubs cannot directly influence other clubs. Its in the damn cba
Players cant be instructed what to do either.
6. You guys are buying the argument teams are smart and all players are greedy and all agents failed to read the market.
7. The market changed because of what reason exactly
8. Only 1 100 mil contract was signed in 17. No one screamed collusion because everyone else got signed
9. It can both be a market correction and collusion. And not a vast one. It merely would take 2 clubs participating and with 12 clubs rebuilding and 8 avoiding the tax it leaves 10 teams give or take. Far easier to perpetuate wage suppression with less clubs involved.
10. Teams cannot compare offers w each other thanks to the 1990 collusion settlement. No information bank.
11. How are people against labor and pro billionaire class. It is mirroring politics and its maddening. Im not even screaming im literally laying out what I got


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Online  Re: DDSM (Double Diamond Sports Management)
Posted: February 06, 2018, 9:29 AM Post
Posts: 4158
Location: New Berlin, WI
agent39 said:
No it clearly isnt

1. How many guys will reach that market
2. How many clubs will be in in those bids?
3. The luxury tax is not a cap and is negligable when compared to revenues. Its ready made cover. Its in cba so that part is life. It doesnt mean both scenarios are not occuring.
4. Player revenues have only dipped year to year 3 times ever. All 3 times collusion waa proven.
5. Clubs cannot directly influence other clubs. Its in the damn cba
Players cant be instructed what to do either.
6. You guys are buying the argument teams are smart and all players are greedy and all agents failed to read the market.
7. The market changed because of what reason exactly
8. Only 1 100 mil contract was signed in 17. No one screamed collusion because everyone else got signed
9. It can both be a market correction and collusion. And not a vast one. It merely would take 2 clubs participating and with 12 clubs rebuilding and 8 avoiding the tax it leaves 10 teams give or take. Far easier to perpetuate wage suppression with less clubs involved.
10. Teams cannot compare offers w each other thanks to the 1990 collusion settlement. No information bank.
11. How are people against labor and pro billionaire class. It is mirroring politics and its maddening. Im not even screaming im literally laying out what I got


You really don't think GM's/front offices see the results of the long term deals into players late 30s? Ellsbury, pujols, zimmerman, sandoval, kemp, crawford, hamilton, I could keep going. Every one of these players screwed over the team that signed them. I get that these guys were vastly underpaid for their production earlier in their career, but does that mean players should get wildly overpaid to be below replacement in their mid-late 30s? These bad contracts inhibit a teams ability to compete, and inevitably can get GM's fired.

It would be much more fair to change the structure of team control so players are paid more in their primes but in a way that maintains reasonable competitive balance, but there isn't an easy answer to that.


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Online  Re: DDSM (Double Diamond Sports Management)
Posted: February 06, 2018, 10:48 AM Post
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I think a major issue that hasn't really been talked about with regards to the current state of things is that MLB front offices (& in turn teams) became much more analytically inclined betwwen the 2011 & 2016 CBAs. During this same time MLBPA seemingly maintained the status quo & fell behind from an information standpoint. Never a good place to be in negotiations with billion$ at stake.

MLB players had it the best economically of the three major sports for a long time but at this point they've been passed by the NBA, whose model they should attempt to emulate in some fashion. Salary cap/floor to ensure that players are guaranteed a certain % of league revenue each season.

Good luck getting the owners to agree to that at this point.


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Online  Re: DDSM (Double Diamond Sports Management)
Posted: February 06, 2018, 12:43 PM Post
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agent39 said:
jerichoholicninja said:
The more the players and agents keep screaming collusion the worse their side looks. It's all about the 2018 free agents (Harper, Machado, Kershaw, etc.). Therefore Boston, New York, LA, and Chicago aren't out there driving up costs this year so they can have money next year for those guys.



Oh because theyre so strapped for cash now? What a ******** argument. Its not a damn cap.


Players get offered what management feels they're worth. The general consensus is that this year's free agents aren't worth that much. Next year, when guys are getting $200M+ deals, that's what management will feel they are worth too.


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