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2019-06-25: Mariners (Gonzales) at Brewers (Davies) [Brewers lose, 8-3]

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Offline  Re: 2019-06-25: Mariners (Gonzales) at Brewers (Davies) 7:10 PM CDT
Posted: June 25, 2019, 9:36 PM Post
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adambr2 said:
It won't go very appreciated in a 7-3 game, but that was an unbelievable catch by Gamel.


More runs saved for the Brewers' pythagorean record!!!


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Offline  Re: 2019-06-25: Mariners (Gonzales) at Brewers (Davies) 7:10 PM CDT
Posted: June 25, 2019, 9:37 PM Post
Posts: 18985
This is why I laugh when managers/commentators/fans fret over 'losing' your challenge in the late innings if you challenge a close play and lose. They'll literally let you look at whatever you want if you ask them regardless of your challenge situation.


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Offline  Re: 2019-06-25: Mariners (Gonzales) at Brewers (Davies) 7:10 PM CDT
Posted: June 25, 2019, 9:38 PM Post
Posts: 1219
trwi7 said:
Bulldogboy said:
Selfish of him not to go down


No it's not and they haven't even asked him too.



Yeah they did


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Offline  Re: 2019-06-25: Mariners (Gonzales) at Brewers (Davies) 7:10 PM CDT
Posted: June 25, 2019, 9:41 PM Post
Posts: 18985
"The beauty of baseball is there is another game to play the next day."

I feel like Bill and BA say this a lot lately.


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Offline  Re: 2019-06-25: Mariners (Gonzales) at Brewers (Davies) 7:10 PM CDT
Posted: June 25, 2019, 9:42 PM Post
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willie key said:
trwi7 said:
Bulldogboy said:
Selfish of him not to go down


No it's not and they haven't even asked him too.



Yeah they did


If the pay is the same, then it really is pretty selfish of Nelson...If the pay isn't the same then it is actually just as selfish but much more understandably selfish in the Good old American kind of way...


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Online  Re: 2019-06-25: Mariners (Gonzales) at Brewers (Davies) 7:10 PM CDT
Posted: June 25, 2019, 9:43 PM Post
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adambr2 said:
This is why I laugh when managers/commentators/fans fret over 'losing' your challenge in the late innings if you challenge a close play and lose. They'll literally let you look at whatever you want if you ask them regardless of your challenge situation.

Yeah, I am to the point of why even go through the whole charade of the “manager’s challenge.” Just have a system that looks at every close play and only changes the outcomes with truly indisputable evidence (which doesn’t always seem to be the case now). The games are already 4 hours anyway, what’s another half hour tacked on at this point?


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Offline  Re: 2019-06-25: Mariners (Gonzales) at Brewers (Davies) 7:10 PM CDT
Posted: June 25, 2019, 9:49 PM Post
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Oxy said:
If the pay is the same, then it really is pretty selfish of Nelson...If the pay isn't the same then it is actually just as selfish but much more understandably selfish in the Good old American kind of way...


Why would any player choose to ride the bus in the minors instead of all the amenities they get as major leaguers? It's easy for everyone to say that but what would you do if they were asking you to go down and ride a bus and share a hotel room and have to find an apartment and move a lot of your stuff down there? I'm guessing you probably wouldn't want to do that either and I don't blame any player who's earned the right to decline a minor league assignment doing so.

Cards' fans wear jorts.


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Offline  Re: 2019-06-25: Mariners (Gonzales) at Brewers (Davies) 7:10 PM CDT
Posted: June 25, 2019, 9:50 PM Post
Posts: 18985
The pay is the same. There are still many perks associated with being on an MLB team that he loses.

Regardless, it is not selfish, and I wish people would understand that. It is 100% his right under the collective bargaining agreement. It is pretty much standard practice for players not to just willingly give up their collectively bargained rights to benefit the franchise with no compensation.

If you've ever worked for a company with a union, you should know that the decisions you make regarding your works rights don't just affect you, they affect all your fellow members, and decisions are generally made with that in mind. When you give up that right not to be optioned you're setting a precedent for the next guy who comes around in that situation. It is about more than just Jimmy Nelson, it is about not setting precedent for future 5+ service year players.


Last edited by adambr2 on June 25, 2019, 9:52 PM, edited 1 time in total.

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Offline  Re: 2019-06-25: Mariners (Gonzales) at Brewers (Davies) 7:10 PM CDT
Posted: June 25, 2019, 9:51 PM Post
Posts: 2352
willie key said:
trwi7 said:
Bulldogboy said:
Selfish of him not to go down


No it's not and they haven't even asked him too.



Yeah they did

Umm yeah they did. He said no.


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Offline  Re: 2019-06-25: Mariners (Gonzales) at Brewers (Davies) 7:10 PM CDT
Posted: June 25, 2019, 9:55 PM Post
Posts: 2352
adambr2 said:
trwi7 said:
Bulldogboy said:
Selfish of him not to go down


No it's not and they haven't even asked him too.


My guess is that they did and he said no, as Stearns admitted it was "discussed". I don't think they're going to come out and flat out tell us that he refused.

But agreed, it's not on Nelson. That's his right. It's on the organization for giving him that right when they could have avoided it easily.

It's true that it's his right but the team has stuck by him and allowed him to work his way back. If he isn't quite ready which is totally understandable why expect them to put you out there to lose major league games? That's not right.


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Offline  Re: 2019-06-25: Mariners (Gonzales) at Brewers (Davies) 7:10 PM CDT
Posted: June 25, 2019, 9:59 PM Post
Posts: 18985
Because they didn't option him by June 11th. They could have done that and if they had Nelson would have had no say. It's not Nelson's job to protect the team from bad results at all costs, it's his job to go out there and pitch to the best of his abilities, which he is doing. Why should he bail them out because they made a poor business decision not to option him by June 11th?


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Offline  Re: 2019-06-25: Mariners (Gonzales) at Brewers (Davies) 7:10 PM CDT
Posted: June 25, 2019, 10:01 PM Post
Posts: 1219
trwi7 said:
Oxy said:
If the pay is the same, then it really is pretty selfish of Nelson...If the pay isn't the same then it is actually just as selfish but much more understandably selfish in the Good old American kind of way...


Why would any player choose to ride the bus in the minors instead of all the amenities they get as major leaguers? It's easy for everyone to say that but what would you do if they were asking you to go down and ride a bus and share a hotel room and have to find an apartment and move a lot of your stuff down there? I'm guessing you probably wouldn't want to do that either and I don't blame any player who's earned the right to decline a minor league assignment doing so.



Then it’s all about you and not the team. Because the dude doesn’t belong here. Yet

I don’t know if the rest of the roster feels great about playing glorified simulated games because jimmy Nelson doesn’t want to ride a bus

I wonder if the rest of the locker room thinks of 2019 as a throw away year to let jimmy Nelson and Travis Shaw just have workouts in actual games


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Offline  Re: 2019-06-25: Mariners (Gonzales) at Brewers (Davies) 7:10 PM CDT
Posted: June 25, 2019, 10:03 PM Post
Posts: 1219
adambr2 said:
Because they didn't option him by June 11th. They could have done that and if they had Nelson would have had no say. It's not Nelson's job to protect the team from bad results at all costs, it's his job to go out there and pitch to the best of his abilities, which he is doing. Why should he bail them out because they made a poor business decision not to option him by June 11th?


Yep. The brewers organization bent over for this guy

I don’t think anyone should feel sorry for jimmy Nelson. The brewers organization sure as hell didn’t do him wrong


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Offline  Re: 2019-06-25: Mariners (Gonzales) at Brewers (Davies) 7:10 PM CDT
Posted: June 25, 2019, 10:03 PM Post
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willie key said:
Then it’s all about you and not the team. Because the dude doesn’t belong here. Yet


Yeah, it is all about him because he earned the right to choose. And he has every right to choose what's best for him and what's best for him is being in the majors and nobody should blame him one bit for that.

Cards' fans wear jorts.


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Offline  Re: 2019-06-25: Mariners (Gonzales) at Brewers (Davies) 7:10 PM CDT
Posted: June 25, 2019, 10:05 PM Post
Posts: 18985
willie key said:
trwi7 said:
Oxy said:
If the pay is the same, then it really is pretty selfish of Nelson...If the pay isn't the same then it is actually just as selfish but much more understandably selfish in the Good old American kind of way...


Why would any player choose to ride the bus in the minors instead of all the amenities they get as major leaguers? It's easy for everyone to say that but what would you do if they were asking you to go down and ride a bus and share a hotel room and have to find an apartment and move a lot of your stuff down there? I'm guessing you probably wouldn't want to do that either and I don't blame any player who's earned the right to decline a minor league assignment doing so.



Then it’s all about you and not the team. Because the dude doesn’t belong here. Yet


And once again, the team had up until June 11th to option Nelson without the need for his consent and they willingly chose not to.


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Online  Re: 2019-06-25: Mariners (Gonzales) at Brewers (Davies) [Brewers lose, 8-3]
Posted: June 25, 2019, 10:05 PM Post
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I really hope they place Lorenzo Cain on the 10-day IL retroactive to 6/22 and call someone up before tomorrow night’s game. I would guess that Wilkerson may get sent down tomorrow also.


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Offline  Re: 2019-06-25: Mariners (Gonzales) at Brewers (Davies) 7:10 PM CDT
Posted: June 25, 2019, 10:05 PM Post
Posts: 2352
adambr2 said:
Because they didn't option him by June 11th. They could have done that and if they had Nelson would have had no say. It's not Nelson's job to protect the team from bad results at all costs, it's his job to go out there and pitch to the best of his abilities, which he is doing. Why should he bail them out because they made a poor business decision not to option him by June 11th?

I agree with that. The brewers screwed up again. As I've said the roster management has been brutal. Nelson isn't under any obligation to do it but you have teammates who deserve to be given the best opportunity to win. Is he it? Doubtful right now. I would think go get right and you'll be back quick. The team needs him so they have no reason to keep him down longer than need be.


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Offline  Re: 2019-06-25: Mariners (Gonzales) at Brewers (Davies) 7:10 PM CDT
Posted: June 25, 2019, 10:07 PM Post
Posts: 18985
Bulldogboy said:
adambr2 said:
Because they didn't option him by June 11th. They could have done that and if they had Nelson would have had no say. It's not Nelson's job to protect the team from bad results at all costs, it's his job to go out there and pitch to the best of his abilities, which he is doing. Why should he bail them out because they made a poor business decision not to option him by June 11th?

I agree with that. The brewers screwed up again. As I've said the roster management has been brutal. Nelson isn't under any obligation to do it but you have teammates who deserve to be given the best opportunity to win. Is he it? Doubtful right now. I would think go get right and you'll be back quick. The team needs him so they have no reason to keep him down longer than need be.


I like David Stearns a lot, but between the service time management of Nelson and demoting Hiura, this has been his worst month as a GM that I can recall

And I mentioned this, but Nelson likely has pressure from the MLBPA not to accept a minors assignment. As a member of the MLBPA it's about as much protecting everyone's interest as his own.


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Offline  Re: 2019-06-25: Mariners (Gonzales) at Brewers (Davies) [Brewers lose, 8-3]
Posted: June 25, 2019, 10:16 PM Post
Posts: 977
Gennett released, Schoop traded for, Santana traded, Hiura under-used this season, Miley released, Lyles released, Shaw over-used this season ... somebody in management is over-rated. I'm just getting warmed up ...


Last edited by treego14 on June 25, 2019, 10:17 PM, edited 1 time in total.

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Offline  Re: 2019-06-25: Mariners (Gonzales) at Brewers (Davies) 7:10 PM CDT
Posted: June 25, 2019, 10:17 PM Post
Posts: 1219
trwi7 said:
willie key said:
Then it’s all about you and not the team. Because the dude doesn’t belong here. Yet


Yeah, it is all about him because he earned the right to choose. And he has every right to choose what's best for him and what's best for him is being in the majors and nobody should blame him one bit for that.



Earned? The guy has played three years plus of Major League Baseball. It’s a loophole that was missed by a couple of days that is somewhat random deadline

What happened before June 11th and after June 11th that made jimmy Nelson a guy that the brewers could have done anything they wanted to. They could have sent him to the Siberia railcats. Then after the magical June 11th, he’s now some untouchable veteran that’s earned the right to suck to everyone detriment

I get the point about the Union and any decision he makes has ramifications

The brewers knew the rules and they have let Shaw and Nelson enjoy the majors when they didn’t have to I don’t think players can ever whine about the organization treating people bad anymore


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