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2020-09-21: Brewers (Woodruff) at Reds (Castillo) [Brewers lose, 6-3]

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Offline  Re: 2020-09-21: Brewers (Woodruff) at Reds (Castillo) 5:40 PM CDT
Posted: September 21, 2020, 7:57 PM Post
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markedman5 said:
Lostpawn said:
This team of mostly non-hitting rentals and strikeout machines (at the plate) is one of the more uninspiring ones the Brewers have fielded in the past decade. And that’s saying something. The past offseason looks to have set the team back a few years. And that really sucks, with the Yelich contract hanging over their heads.

Maybe they strike gold this coming offseason. But if their player investment strategy doesn’t change, they are in for many more years of the same.


Sky is falling!

This past offseason was designed in a way to avoid setting themselves back for the future. They can simply discard a majority of the players they brought in this past offseason. They didn’t make any move that is going to sink them long-term, unless you think Yelich is going to fall off a cliff (which I’m betting against).


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Offline  Re: 2020-09-21: Brewers (Woodruff) at Reds (Castillo) [Brewers lose, 6-3]
Posted: September 21, 2020, 8:00 PM Post
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Bill James once said that bad teams blame their best players for their problems, rather than recognizing that they need more good players. Seems like fans do this too sometimes...


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Offline  Re: 2020-09-21: Brewers (Woodruff) at Reds (Castillo) [Brewers lose, 6-3]
Posted: September 21, 2020, 8:05 PM Post
Posts: 413
SoCalBrewfan said:
Bill James once said that bad teams blame their best players for their problems, rather than recognizing that they need more good players. Seems like fans do this too sometimes...

Probably because the good players get paid so dang much.


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Online  Re: 2020-09-21: Brewers (Woodruff) at Reds (Castillo) [Brewers lose, 6-3]
Posted: September 21, 2020, 8:06 PM Post
Posts: 8137
SoCalBrewfan said:
Bill James once said that bad teams blame their best players for their problems, rather than recognizing that they need more good players. Seems like fans do this too sometimes...


When your best players have seasons that are way below projections it hurts more then when a marginal guy does.

Yes we need more good players.......but Hiura, Yelich, and others having bad years is more to blame this season.


Last edited by markedman5 on September 21, 2020, 8:07 PM, edited 1 time in total.

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Online  Re: 2020-09-21: Brewers (Woodruff) at Reds (Castillo) [Brewers lose, 6-3]
Posted: September 21, 2020, 8:06 PM Post
Posts: 8137
Cards and Giants both losing.


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Offline  Re: 2020-09-21: Brewers (Woodruff) at Reds (Castillo) [Brewers lose, 6-3]
Posted: September 21, 2020, 8:09 PM Post
Posts: 413
Bulldogboy said:
Woodruff seems like he pitches just good enough to get beat. Some of it is the offense is godawful but man. He just seems not quite where we thought he would be. Meanwhile all of a sudden Burnes is unhittable. Crazy


I'm pretty happy with where Woodruff is. After todays disastrous start his ERA fell to 3.43 on the year. In September his ERA is 2.95 and yet he's 0-2 for the month. I'm not sure if he's pitching just good enough to get beat or not, but it seems like the results of his pitching and the results of the game overall don't seem to coincide this year.


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Offline  Re: 2020-09-21: Brewers (Woodruff) at Reds (Castillo) 5:40 PM CDT
Posted: September 21, 2020, 8:10 PM Post
Posts: 263
Location: Miami, FL
markedman5 said:
Lostpawn said:
This team of mostly non-hitting rentals and strikeout machines (at the plate) is one of the more uninspiring ones the Brewers have fielded in the past decade. And that’s saying something. The past offseason looks to have set the team back a few years. And that really sucks, with the Yelich contract hanging over their heads.

Maybe they strike gold this coming offseason. But if their player investment strategy doesn’t change, they are in for many more years of the same.


Sky is falling!


LOL. Not at all what I said. I said that I think this years team isn’t fun to watch, that their offseason acquisitions did nothing for the future and set them back in the present, and if they make the same mistakes ongoing they will be in the same situation. Where in there is the “sky falling”?

I’m not an extremist. This team is just boring and bad. And a decent bit of the reason is the last offseason.


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Offline  Re: 2020-09-21: Brewers (Woodruff) at Reds (Castillo) [Brewers lose, 6-3]
Posted: September 21, 2020, 8:10 PM Post
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markedman5 said:
Cards and Giants both losing.

And the Phillies lost. The Marlins are losing. Overall a lot of scores trending the right direction elsewhere.

Maybe everyone just realized they and their families have to quarantine in a hotel and playoff bubble if they advance.


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Offline  Re: 2020-09-21: Brewers (Woodruff) at Reds (Castillo) 5:40 PM CDT
Posted: September 21, 2020, 8:14 PM Post
Posts: 263
Location: Miami, FL
Eye Black said:
markedman5 said:
Lostpawn said:
This team of mostly non-hitting rentals and strikeout machines (at the plate) is one of the more uninspiring ones the Brewers have fielded in the past decade. And that’s saying something. The past offseason looks to have set the team back a few years. And that really sucks, with the Yelich contract hanging over their heads.

Maybe they strike gold this coming offseason. But if their player investment strategy doesn’t change, they are in for many more years of the same.


Sky is falling!

This past offseason was designed in a way to avoid setting themselves back for the future. They can simply discard a majority of the players they brought in this past offseason. They didn’t make any move that is going to sink them long-term, unless you think Yelich is going to fall off a cliff (which I’m betting against).

I certainly don’t think Yelich will fall off a cliff. My opinion about the long term impact of the last offseason is simply that they didn’t make any moves that appear forward looking. If you aren’t building for the future now, then that future won’t come. Unless they get lucky in the FA lottery, which they appear to have lost the last time around.


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Offline  Re: 2020-09-21: Brewers (Woodruff) at Reds (Castillo) 5:40 PM CDT
Posted: September 21, 2020, 8:36 PM Post
Posts: 21606
LouisEly said:
adambr2 said:
Jace Peterson bought himself another week, like this game could get any worse.

His OPS is now .787, and he has the best K:BB ratio on the entire team.


It was .648 before tonight. With this limited ABs, of course one good night is going to swing it. He's got almost a 1,700 plate appearance sample size showing he's not a very good player.


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Offline  Re: 2020-09-21: Brewers (Woodruff) at Reds (Castillo) 5:40 PM CDT
Posted: September 21, 2020, 8:39 PM Post
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Lostpawn said:
I certainly don’t think Yelich will fall off a cliff. My opinion about the long term impact of the last offseason is simply that they didn’t make any moves that appear forward looking. If you aren’t building for the future now, then that future won’t come. Unless they get lucky in the FA lottery, which they appear to have lost the last time around.

The problem is even given the benefit of hindsight, what moves should they have made this past offseason that were going to make a significant impact on the future? I think they viewed the Urias/Lauer trade as a move for the future, but it doesn’t seem like there were a lot of clear opportunities to add future value in low risk acquisitions. I didn’t even like the offseason, but when I try to draw up a better alternative it proves difficult. I would’ve loved for them to have signed Rendon, but that amount of financial commitment and risk wasn’t likely something they ever seriously considered.


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Offline  Re: 2020-09-21: Brewers (Woodruff) at Reds (Castillo) 5:40 PM CDT
Posted: September 21, 2020, 8:52 PM Post
Posts: 263
Location: Miami, FL
Eye Black said:
Lostpawn said:
I certainly don’t think Yelich will fall off a cliff. My opinion about the long term impact of the last offseason is simply that they didn’t make any moves that appear forward looking. If you aren’t building for the future now, then that future won’t come. Unless they get lucky in the FA lottery, which they appear to have lost the last time around.

The problem is even given the benefit of hindsight, what moves should they have made this past offseason that were going to make a significant impact on the future? I think they viewed the Urias/Lauer trade as a move for the future, but it doesn’t seem like there were a lot of clear opportunities to add future value in low risk acquisitions. I didn’t even like the offseason, but when I try to draw up a better alternative it proves difficult.

That’s a very fair point - I appreciate it. Since I have no idea what the actual market looked like last offseason (few of us do), the only counter I have is that they lost more assets than they seemed to want in return. From an outsider perspective it appears they were just trying to shed salary and hope they got lucky with some marginal FAs, and they lost. Since by most accounts they have the worst farm system in baseball, I’d have liked to see more forward looking moves. But I have absolutely no clue what those moves would have been.

Thanks for the conversation!


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Offline  Re: 2020-09-21: Brewers (Woodruff) at Reds (Castillo) 5:40 PM CDT
Posted: September 21, 2020, 9:22 PM Post
Posts: 5040
turborickey said:
yourout said:
Narváez might have the worst swing path on the team and that is a high bar to reach with this squad.


This guy is just horrible...

We might be best off just keeping Nottingham and Pina next year to be honest.


Would the Brewers be able to option him? He may be destined for a long AAA stretch to begin next season while Pina Nottingham duo start the season.


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Offline  Re: 2020-09-21: Brewers (Woodruff) at Reds (Castillo) 5:40 PM CDT
Posted: September 21, 2020, 9:52 PM Post
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Literally every other game worked to our advantage tonight. Still a chance!


brewcrewdue80 said:
turborickey said:
yourout said:
Narváez might have the worst swing path on the team and that is a high bar to reach with this squad.


This guy is just horrible...

We might be best off just keeping Nottingham and Pina next year to be honest.


Would the Brewers be able to option him? He may be destined for a long AAA stretch to begin next season while Pina Nottingham duo start the season.


Hadn't even considered that, but yes, they can. He's also arbitration eligible, so they could decide to pull a Schoop and decide it's not the right fit and straight up non-tender.


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Offline  Re: 2020-09-21: Brewers (Woodruff) at Reds (Castillo) 5:40 PM CDT
Posted: September 21, 2020, 11:51 PM Post
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brewcrewdue80 said:
turborickey said:
yourout said:
Narváez might have the worst swing path on the team and that is a high bar to reach with this squad.


This guy is just horrible...

We might be best off just keeping Nottingham and Pina next year to be honest.


Would the Brewers be able to option him? He may be destined for a long AAA stretch to begin next season while Pina Nottingham duo start the season.


This seems like the winning move. Make Narvaez prove it in AAA while holding onto both Nottingham and Pina. Then figure something out next June. Hopefully we'll have at least 4 catchers ready for MLB action (Feliciano? Henry?) giving us some nice trade bait.


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Offline  Re: 2020-09-21: Brewers (Woodruff) at Reds (Castillo) [Brewers lose, 6-3]
Posted: September 22, 2020, 1:14 AM Post
Posts: 3120
Doubt it, the Brewers are not going to pay a guy millions to sit in AAA. Might offer him arbitration and still cut him in Spring Training but imagine stearns will non tender him or Pina.


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