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2020-09-25, Game 1: Cardinals (Flaherty) at Brewers (Suter) [Brewers win, 3-0 -- Excellent start from Suter; Williams and Hader finish it off]

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Offline  Re: 2020-09-25, Game 1: Cardinals (Flaherty) at Brewers (Suter) 4:15 PM CDT
Posted: September 25, 2020, 5:13 PM Post
Posts: 22366
homer said:
Threw one changeup that whole inning.


Really odd. I wonder if that was deliberate trying to keep them off balance or if he just wasn't comfortable with his change tonight.

I guess you could do worse than a 98 MPH heater as your "secondary" pitch.


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Online  Re: 2020-09-25, Game 1: Cardinals (Flaherty) at Brewers (Suter) 4:15 PM CDT
Posted: September 25, 2020, 5:14 PM Post
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Now pitching for the Cardinals...

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"Dustin Pedroia doesn't have the strength or bat speed to hit major-league pitching consistently, and he has no power......He probably has a future as a backup infielder if he can stop rolling over to third base and shortstop." Keith Law, 2006


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Online  Re: 2020-09-25, Game 1: Cardinals (Flaherty) at Brewers (Suter) 4:15 PM CDT
Posted: September 25, 2020, 5:14 PM Post
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Speaking of his change up, here are the best pitches this season by run value (per Daren Willman). The stat obviously favors starters who throw more innings.

Three Brewers in the top ten.

Image


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Offline  Re: 2020-09-25, Game 1: Cardinals (Flaherty) at Brewers (Suter) 4:15 PM CDT
Posted: September 25, 2020, 5:14 PM Post
Posts: 22366
I think with a 3 run lead you have to commit to saving Hader for Game 2.


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Offline  Re: 2020-09-25, Game 1: Cardinals (Flaherty) at Brewers (Suter) 4:15 PM CDT
Posted: September 25, 2020, 5:16 PM Post
Posts: 263
Location: Miami, FL
homer said:
homer said:
Without looking, I'd guess Jack Flaherty's ERA against the Brewers is 412.22


It's 5.72

I was pretty close.

Rounding error. Happens to all of us.


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Online  Re: 2020-09-25, Game 1: Cardinals (Flaherty) at Brewers (Suter) 4:15 PM CDT
Posted: September 25, 2020, 5:16 PM Post
Posts: 6355
Maybe it's my imagination but for the past week hitters have been more disciplined in laying off Williams' change up.

"You're not going to have him when you want him and you're going to run out of games. He can't pitch 90 games. It's just not going to work. If anyone thinks it's going to work, show me how."- Craig Counsell on Josh Hader.


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Offline  Re: 2020-09-25, Game 1: Cardinals (Flaherty) at Brewers (Suter) 4:15 PM CDT
Posted: September 25, 2020, 5:16 PM Post
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adambr2 said:
I think with a 3 run lead you have to commit to saving Hader for Game 2.

Especially with Goldschmidt, Dejong, and Molina coming up. I wouldn't go with a lefty.


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Offline  Re: 2020-09-25, Game 1: Cardinals (Flaherty) at Brewers (Suter) 4:15 PM CDT
Posted: September 25, 2020, 5:17 PM Post
Posts: 294
adambr2 said:
I think with a 3 run lead you have to commit to saving Hader for Game 2.


Agreed, but he's warming. So not happening.

Unless Yelich or Braun can knock one out of here.


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Offline  Re: 2020-09-25, Game 1: Cardinals (Flaherty) at Brewers (Suter) 4:15 PM CDT
Posted: September 25, 2020, 5:17 PM Post
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adambr2 said:
I think with a 3 run lead you have to commit to saving Hader for Game 2.


Agreed. I hope they go this route.

"I'm not as good as I was but in big moments I'm still the guy. I want that opportunity." -Ryan Braun


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Online  Re: 2020-09-25, Game 1: Cardinals (Flaherty) at Brewers (Suter) 4:15 PM CDT
Posted: September 25, 2020, 5:18 PM Post
Posts: 6355
homer said:
Now pitching for the Cardinals...

Image

Narvaez could help him out with his swing.

"You're not going to have him when you want him and you're going to run out of games. He can't pitch 90 games. It's just not going to work. If anyone thinks it's going to work, show me how."- Craig Counsell on Josh Hader.


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Offline  Re: 2020-09-25, Game 1: Cardinals (Flaherty) at Brewers (Suter) 4:15 PM CDT
Posted: September 25, 2020, 5:18 PM Post
Posts: 22366
I hate that they are warming Hader, absolutely hate it. You can't treat a 3 run lead like a traditional save situation especially when you need to win both games today. I feel like we are back in the Ron Roenicke/Kameron Loe era.


Last edited by adambr2 on September 25, 2020, 5:19 PM, edited 1 time in total.

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Offline  Re: 2020-09-25, Game 1: Cardinals (Flaherty) at Brewers (Suter) 4:15 PM CDT
Posted: September 25, 2020, 5:19 PM Post
Posts: 294
Assuming there is no way Hader could go in both games.


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Offline  Re: 2020-09-25, Game 1: Cardinals (Flaherty) at Brewers (Suter) 4:15 PM CDT
Posted: September 25, 2020, 5:19 PM Post
Posts: 1588
Location: Central PA
Guess Counsell is hoping for a blowout in Game 2. If he ends up mismanaging a bullpen in a doubleheader again....


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Online  Re: 2020-09-25, Game 1: Cardinals (Flaherty) at Brewers (Suter) 4:15 PM CDT
Posted: September 25, 2020, 5:20 PM Post
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This Hader decision is strange. You have to win 3 out of 4, so increase your probability to be able to do that.


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Offline  Re: 2020-09-25, Game 1: Cardinals (Flaherty) at Brewers (Suter) 4:15 PM CDT
Posted: September 25, 2020, 5:21 PM Post
Posts: 2704
Yelich sucks on D.


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Offline  Re: 2020-09-25, Game 1: Cardinals (Flaherty) at Brewers (Suter) 4:15 PM CDT
Posted: September 25, 2020, 5:21 PM Post
Posts: 263
Location: Miami, FL
bm1090 said:
Assuming there is no way Hader could go in both games.

Last time this situation came up I said that there was no way Hader would go both ends of the doubleheader. This board told me very adamantly that yes, he can. So I’m not commenting on this matter any further.


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Online  Re: 2020-09-25, Game 1: Cardinals (Flaherty) at Brewers (Suter) 4:15 PM CDT
Posted: September 25, 2020, 5:21 PM Post
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Totally forgot the game is 7 innings long.

"Dustin Pedroia doesn't have the strength or bat speed to hit major-league pitching consistently, and he has no power......He probably has a future as a backup infielder if he can stop rolling over to third base and shortstop." Keith Law, 2006


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Offline  Re: 2020-09-25, Game 1: Cardinals (Flaherty) at Brewers (Suter) 4:15 PM CDT
Posted: September 25, 2020, 5:21 PM Post
Posts: 2704
Hader in this spot makes zero sense to me. Especially if you have no closer in game two.


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Offline  Re: 2020-09-25, Game 1: Cardinals (Flaherty) at Brewers (Suter) 4:15 PM CDT
Posted: September 25, 2020, 5:22 PM Post
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He won’t go back to back games if he throws a ton of pitches, that’s for sure.

"I'm not as good as I was but in big moments I'm still the guy. I want that opportunity." -Ryan Braun


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Online  Re: 2020-09-25, Game 1: Cardinals (Flaherty) at Brewers (Suter) 4:15 PM CDT
Posted: September 25, 2020, 5:23 PM Post
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Knebel to the rescue.

"Dustin Pedroia doesn't have the strength or bat speed to hit major-league pitching consistently, and he has no power......He probably has a future as a backup infielder if he can stop rolling over to third base and shortstop." Keith Law, 2006


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