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Outfield

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Offline  Re: Outfield
#41

Posted: May 17, 2017, 11:53 AM Post
Posts: 1130
MrTPlush said:
A Swing and A Drive said:
I think the idea of trading Broxton, Santana and even Villar in a pursuit of future TOR (Top Of Rotation) starters is one the Brewers brass needs to be open to.

These are players all at positions of depth and strength for the organization and I think it's a great idea to use them to address the organizations areas of weakness. Namely pitching, but also higher ceiling offensive talent than we currently have in the system.

Instead of being part of the next contending Brewers club, I almost consider those 3 to be part of the next "wave" of trading chips that Stearns will have to work with.


I would have to strongly disagree that 2B is a position of strength. We have two guys in the minors that are likely multiple years away and very much unproven. If you are trading Villar in hopes one of those guys replace him successfully in 2+ years is a bit optimistic.


I'm not saying to trade Villar, as I don't think we would get value. But for some reason if someone loved him as the lead of a package, and the Brewers could get a decent starter, why not?

Basically you would be giving Perez an everyday home. Even if we needed him elsewhere, you have Franklin/Sogard/DeJesus/Rivera in the mean time. We wouldn't be solely relying only on Dubon/Diaz for the future, but I could see one ready in 2019. Until then there are plenty of Gennetts around for basically free or trade from our surplus of AAA OFs for an about ready to come up to the majors AAA 2B.


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Offline  Re: Outfield
#42

Posted: May 18, 2017, 1:30 PM Post
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I think, given our extreme upper minors depth in CF, that making Broxton the centerpiece in a package that would return someone like Gerrit Cole does make some sense to be thinking about doing. Brinson has quietly made some improvements this year that show that he's just about ready to be a full time Major Leaguer. His walk rate this year is a well above average 11.4%, up from 5.2% at AA with the Rangers last year and up from a seriously low 2.2% at CS last year, while still maintaining a decent K rate of 21.2%. His BABIP is .390 right now but he has put up similarly high numbers at various minor league levels before. He's a plus defender in all 3 spots in the outfield, and he's got a 142 wRC+. There's not much left to prove at AAA, but he needs to get regular playing time in Milwaukee and given the pretty awesome performance from our outfield this year the only way he's going to get to do that is if we trade somebody. I personally prefer Santana to Broxton for any number of reasons, and think he'd be a PERFECT fit in LF for years to come, and Broxton definitely seems like he could take the place of 2 top 100 prospects in a major deal for pitching given that he's very controllable and a proven asset offensively and defensively.

Now, some caveats:
- It would probably have to be someone other than Gerrit Cole, as I cannot imagine the world of crap that the Pirates GM would take for having to give up Gerrit Cole to get the guy back that they gave up for Jason Rogers.
- I'm only really interested in trading Broxton if Braun doesn't get traded, and I think the Brewers should really do everything in their power to trade Braun first before listening on Broxton. If Santana can shift to LF and Brinson/Broxton can maybe split time between CF and RF, I'd probably prefer to get some prospects for Braun and rethink a big TOR trade should Cordell/Phillips prove themselves capable of replacing Broxton in 2018.


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Offline  Re: Outfield
#43

Posted: May 26, 2017, 9:29 AM Post
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assuming no trades are made this season with these players (which may indeed happen), beginning next season, the brewers have six outfielders who are in the mix for being a part of the Brewers competitive window. Braun, Santana, Broxton, Cordell, Brinson, Phillips (sorry wren). However, realistically there is only room for four of them, as we would receive way more in trade value than the value of a young OF prospect relegated to fifth wheel sitting the bench.

in addition, we'll have a similar issue at 1B, with Aguilar, Thames and Cooper, with the latter two being able to play competent corner outfield spots that could factor in to which outfielders we keep.

So the way I see it, starting next season, out of these nine guys there's only room for six, and that's if the sixth person can be the 5th OF/back up 1B and the rest should be dealt to maximize trade value. No use keeping any of these guys in AAA next season, if they continue to play even remotely as well as they're playing right now, especially if some could be packaged in to getting a current/future TOR.

So, first do you agree with that? and if you do, which six would you keep and which three would you trade? What a great problem to have!

* side note- this does not factor in the second wave (taylor, reed, coulter, davis) or third wave (clark, ray, Harrison, stokes, Segovia, orimoloye) OF prospects.


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Offline  Re: Outfield
#44

Posted: May 26, 2017, 9:57 AM Post
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Crash2303 said:
assuming no trades are made this season with these players (which may indeed happen), beginning next season, the brewers have six outfielders who are in the mix for being a part of the Brewers competitive window. Braun, Santana, Broxton, Cordell, Brinson, Phillips (sorry wren). However, realistically there is only room for four of them, as we would receive way more in trade value than the value of a young OF prospect relegated to fifth wheel sitting the bench.

in addition, we'll have a similar issue at 1B, with Aguilar, Thames and Cooper, with the latter two being able to play competent corner outfield spots that could factor in to which outfielders we keep.

So the way I see it, starting next season, out of these nine guys there's only room for six, and that's if the sixth person can be the 5th OF/back up 1B and the rest should be dealt to maximize trade value. No use keeping any of these guys in AAA next season, if they continue to play even remotely as well as they're playing right now, especially if some could be packaged in to getting a current/future TOR.

So, first do you agree with that? and if you do, which six would you keep and which three would you trade? What a great problem to have!


If we could get a look at Cooper this year, that would be great. This would make it a lot easier to trading Thames this July.

Other than that, it is hard to judge who should stay, who should go from the AAA guys because none have been seen at the MLB level.

I would like to trade Broxton because he is the older of the bunch and with the tools he possess, we may be able to get a hefty enough of a return.

I would love to see Braun-LF, Brinson-CF, Santana-RF with Phillips filling in for all three positions next season. Then if you wanted to add Cordrell to the bunch, he can fill in at 3B and be the 5th OF with some pop in his bat.


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Offline  Re: Outfield
#45

Posted: May 26, 2017, 10:17 AM Post
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I think the good problem to have right now is that while all these guys are pretty much raking at AAA, the MLB guys are no slouches either, which means we are fortunate that we can trade some of them at their premium value and get something of value in return.

Cooper is always a guy I've heralded but the 1B picture has gotten a lot more crowded in the past few months, with both Thames and Aguilar making strong cases for sticking around long term. Cooper probably doesn't have much trade value given his non-prospect status (although I'm guessing he could creep into top 30 lists if he continues like he's been going), but I do think he could have value for us at the big league level, so that probably means looking to trade Aguilar at some point, and look what we were able to get for Jason Rogers after he had a similar breakout performance (and honestly I think Aguilar could have more value than Rogers). Thames seems like he has the potential to be a franchise player, and we have him locked up cheap, I'd hate to trade him. If Cooper can play some corner OF as a backup in addition to backing up 1B, I'd like to see him get a shot at some point this year or next year.

As for the outfield, the odds of trading Braun are slim at best, and I'm a big Santana supporter and think he has what it takes to stick in RF for the long haul (although I'd prefer him in LF). Broxton is terrific too but given our depth of center fielders, he seems like the best one to trade, and I would think he'd have tremendous value to the right team. Trading prospects will never get you top value because there's still the chance they just never produce in the big leagues, plus I really do think Brinson has the potential to be the best outfielder on the roster in a couple years, not just better than Broxton, and Phillips/Cordell provide a lot of cover in case of extended injury to Braun or as backups to Santana if he regresses.

So for now, the two guys I'd think about trading would be Broxton (as soon as the trade deadline this year) and Aguilar (want him to get enough ABs to be of value to someone and not be seen as an unproven risk, so would probably wait to deal him in the offseason if we think Cooper is a real possibility to backup Thames).


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Offline  Re: Outfield
#46

Posted: May 26, 2017, 10:01 PM Post
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Crash2303 said:
So, first do you agree with that? and if you do, which six would you keep and which three would you trade? What a great problem to have!

* side note- this does not factor in the second wave (taylor, reed, coulter, davis) or third wave (clark, ray, Harrison, stokes, Segovia, orimoloye) OF prospects.


I think this is a decent synopsis of the situation, although I think the second "wave" is much closer to a ripple...

If we aren't going to get a decent return for Braun, I am happy to hang onto him, along with Broxton, Brinson, and Cordell. I'd trade away Santana, Phillips and Reed for young (19/20) pitching with high ceilings. Between Clark, Ray, Harrison, and Gatewood I would think we'll have a replacement for Braun in '21 or '22. I think we have the pieces in place to be a good+ offense for the next 8 years. Sign a FA starter (or two) and trade for another, and we are an 85 win ballclub, anyway. Perhaps more depending on how the staff develops.


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