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Syndergaard and deGrom

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Online  Re: Syndergaard and deGrom
#21

Posted: June 07, 2018, 4:21 PM Post
Posts: 13798
YoungGeezy1 said:
To be confident that we will win every 5th & have a starting pitcher to look forward to... unload. Guessing Peralta, Burnes, Hiura, Lutz for Thor. He is legit as that is under control for pretty long time. Once Jimmy is back, if Woodruff comes back around, and Ortiz and/or Z. Brown can keep developing. We will live. We have OFs in system so losing Lutz won’t kill. Hiura stings a bit since. Hope Dubon comes back to where he was before ACL went.


Still don't think that's enough. Just not a good enough headliner. Its similar to the Yelich package in total value. I think it would take more than that for Noah.


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Offline  Re: Syndergaard and deGrom
#22

Posted: June 07, 2018, 4:28 PM Post
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I honestly don't think we have enough for either one.

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Online  Re: Syndergaard and deGrom
#23

Posted: June 07, 2018, 4:50 PM Post
Posts: 7113
Plus, why would the Mets trade them? Also, I don't trust dealing with the Mets. Brewers have plenty to deal at MLB level and the minors. Just doesn't make sense for either side.


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Offline  Re: Syndergaard and deGrom
#24

Posted: June 07, 2018, 9:01 PM Post
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I would trade anyone but Hader for either one.


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Offline  Re: Syndergaard and deGrom
#25

Posted: June 07, 2018, 9:04 PM Post
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Just about every team in baseball would be interested in Syndergaard or deGrom. The problem with going after either is that there are quite a few teams with a greater volume of high-end prospect currency. I think at least two top 50-ish prospects would be a minimum to even begin having a conversation with the Mets for either pitcher, and for Syndergaard that probably includes a top 10 caliber prospect.

To put this in perspective below are teams with multiple prospects ranked within the top 60 of Baseball America’s 2018 midseason update. The Brewers had one prospect ranked in this range, Keston Hiura at #43.

Braves - Ronald Acuna Jr., Luiz Gohara, Mike Soroka, Austin Riley, Kyle Wright, Ian Anderson, Kolby Allard

Padres - Fernando Tatis Jr., MacKenzie Gore, Luis Urias, Michel Baez, Cal Quantrill, Adrian Morejon (plus two more prospects ranked between 61-100)

Rays - Willy Adames, Brent Honeywell, Brendan McKay, Jesus Sanchez, Jake Bauers (plus two more prospects ranked between 61-100)

White Sox - Eloy Jimenez, Michael Kopech, Alec Hansen, Luis Robert (plus one more prospect ranked between 61-100)

Blue Jays - Vladimir Guerrero Jr., Bo Bichette, Anthony Alford (plus three more prospects ranked between 61-100)

Reds - Nick Senzel, Taylor Trammell, Hunter Greene

Astros - Forrest Whitley, Kyle Tucker, Yordan Alvarez (plus one more prospect ranked between 61-100)

Yankees - Gleyber Torres, Justus Sheffield, Estevan Florial (plus one more prospect ranked between 61-100)

A’s - Jesus Luzardo, A.J. Puk, Franklin Barreto (plus two more prospects ranked between 61-100)

Rangers - Willie Calhoun, Leody Taveras, Julio Pablo Martinez

Nationals - Juan Soto, Victor Robles (plus one more prospect ranked between 61-100)

Indians - Francisco Mejia, Triston McKenzie (plus one more prospect ranked between 61-100)

Rockies - Brendan Rodgers, Ryan McMahon

Dodgers - Keibert Ruiz, Alex Verdugo (plus three more prospects ranked between 61-100)

Pirates - Mitch Keller, Austin Meadows (plus one more prospect ranked between 61-100)

Tigers - Franklin Perez, Alex Faedo (plus two more prospects ranked between 61-100)

Orioles - Austin Hays, Chance Sisco (plus one more prospect ranked between 61-100)

Outside of the top 60 for the Brewers were Corbin Burnes ranked #69 and Freddy Peralta at #97.

I know the prospect rankings used are subjective, but among the actual prospects listed for each team imagine trying to put together a package to compete against the Braves, Astros, Yankees, Indians, Dodgers, or Nationals for either Syndergaard or deGrom. If any of those teams is motivated to acquire either pitcher it isn’t difficult to see how they could assemble a more appealing prospect package than the Brewers. Even teams like the Angels and Twins who aren’t on the list above could easily put together comparable (if not slightly better) prospect packages to the Brewers.


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Offline  Re: Syndergaard and deGrom
#26

Posted: June 08, 2018, 2:04 PM Post

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I wouldnt trade Hader, the way bullpens are being used today, he may have as much value as Thor or deGrom. But I would empty the cupboards down on the farm. Phillips Burnes Peralta and Huira. If they wanted Ray instead of any of those guys Id slide him in there as well. Lutz. Basically pick any four guys.


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Offline  Re: Syndergaard and deGrom
#27

Posted: June 08, 2018, 3:52 PM Post
Posts: 187
trwi7 said:
I honestly don't think we have enough for either one.

I agree. I think Hader has to be included for either and that's probably a no go. Even a non Hader trade is probably something like Hiura, 2 of Burnes, Ortiz, Peralta, Woodruff, and like Santana or Phillips and I don't know if that's enough, don't think there's enough top line talent there without Hader.

Syndergaard had a set back and isn't starting Sunday now too, fwiw.


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Offline  Re: Syndergaard and deGrom
#28

Posted: June 08, 2018, 4:29 PM Post
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The Brewers are sixth in MLB in pitching, and they should empty the farm for a pitcher? No thanks, not in an organization desperate for offense. The pitching has been top 10 in the majors since mid season 2016. The offense has been bad since mid season 2016. We need a bat, badly.

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Offline  Re: Syndergaard and deGrom
#29

Posted: June 08, 2018, 4:50 PM Post
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Never Outhustled said:
The Brewers are sixth in MLB in pitching, and they should empty the farm for a pitcher? No thanks, not in an organization desperate for offense. The pitching has been top 10 in the majors since mid season 2016. The offense has been bad since mid season 2016. We need a bat, badly.


That is almost all on the backs of relievers. Our starters are middle of the pack in ERA with advanced stats putting them in the bottom 10 of pretty much everything. And now our bullpen is starting to give up runs because they typically have to cover at minimum 4 innings every night.

We have a ton of holes on this roster. Starting pitching is one of them.

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Offline  Re: Syndergaard and deGrom
#30

Posted: June 08, 2018, 4:51 PM Post
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Tons of holes? Naw...


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Offline  Re: Syndergaard and deGrom
#31

Posted: June 08, 2018, 4:56 PM Post
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Brew4U said:
Tons of holes? Naw...


Starting pitching, catcher, 2nd base, shortstop. That's 4 out of 9 positions. If Braun and Santana don't start hitting, that's another hole. So yeah, I would say that's a ton of holes.


Last edited by trwi7 on June 08, 2018, 5:02 PM, edited 1 time in total.

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Offline  Re: Syndergaard and deGrom
#32

Posted: June 08, 2018, 4:57 PM Post
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trwi7 said:
Never Outhustled said:
The Brewers are sixth in MLB in pitching, and they should empty the farm for a pitcher? No thanks, not in an organization desperate for offense. The pitching has been top 10 in the majors since mid season 2016. The offense has been bad since mid season 2016. We need a bat, badly.


That is almost all on the backs of relievers. Our starters are middle of the pack in ERA with advanced stats putting them in the bottom 10 of pretty much everything. And now our bullpen is starting to give up runs because they typically have to cover at minimum 4 innings every night.

We have a ton of holes on this roster. Starting pitching is one of them.


So you'd rather lose 2-1 than 3-1? The offense is bad. I don't care about the make-up of the pitching staff. I just care about its results.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"88.6% of all statistics are made up right there on the spot" Todd Snider

-Posted by the fan formerly known as X ellence. David Stearns has brought me back..


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Offline  Re: Syndergaard and deGrom
#33

Posted: June 08, 2018, 5:02 PM Post
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Never Outhustled said:
trwi7 said:
Never Outhustled said:
The Brewers are sixth in MLB in pitching, and they should empty the farm for a pitcher? No thanks, not in an organization desperate for offense. The pitching has been top 10 in the majors since mid season 2016. The offense has been bad since mid season 2016. We need a bat, badly.


That is almost all on the backs of relievers. Our starters are middle of the pack in ERA with advanced stats putting them in the bottom 10 of pretty much everything. And now our bullpen is starting to give up runs because they typically have to cover at minimum 4 innings every night.

We have a ton of holes on this roster. Starting pitching is one of them.


So you'd rather lose 2-1 than 3-1? The offense is bad. I don't care about the make-up of the pitching staff. I just care about its results.


What? I'm saying our starters aren't good. I don't want to trade for deGrom or Syndergaard, I don't think they're available and even if they are I don't think we have enough to get either one anyways.

I'm saying that our starting pitching is bad and they don't go deep into games and that's eventually (maybe starting now) going to have an effect on the effectiveness of the bullpen.

Cards' fans wear jorts.


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Offline  Re: Syndergaard and deGrom
#34

Posted: June 09, 2018, 5:58 AM Post
Posts: 107
Just bought a Hader jersey, he is not going anywhere, not for Syndergaard or DeGrom


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Offline  Re: Syndergaard and deGrom
#35

Posted: June 09, 2018, 7:18 AM Post
Posts: 4133
Count me in for one of the two. I actually don’t even care which. I think the Degrom/Syndergaard type pitcher is exactly what we’ve been missing the last few years. Yeah it would further empty out the system but given how the team is currently out together, with almost all of their key players under control for a few more years, it would buy us some time to start building up the system again. They just have to start hitting on their first round picks.

My offer would include: Ray, Burnes, Woodruff or Peralta, Phillips or Broxton, and Gatewood or Lara.

I’d really like to hang onto Hiura but if the Mets insist on him I’d reorganize my offer to something like Hiura, Ray, Phillips/Broxton, and Woodruff/Peralta.


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Online  Re: Syndergaard and deGrom
#36

Posted: June 09, 2018, 8:31 AM Post
Posts: 13798
The problem with all of these farm system asset offers is that there are about 10 or 15 other teams that would also love either of these two who can blow us out of the water on a prospect offer.

You'd have to include major league talent, specifically Hader, to have a chance at winning the bidding.

Whether or not they'd insist on Hiura isn't even a question. He just wouldn't be nearly as good of a headliner as other teams could offer.


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Offline  Re: Syndergaard and deGrom
#37

Posted: June 09, 2018, 8:41 AM Post
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I agree with Adam. We don’t have a headliner (other than Hader) that gets us into the game. Brinson was our headliner and we used him for Yelich.


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Offline  Re: Syndergaard and deGrom
#38

Posted: June 09, 2018, 9:13 AM Post
Posts: 3204
Just knowing the fact that teams would basically have to include a top ten prospect to think about acquiring either of these two means that the mets would be stupid to trade either one.

I just don't see either being moved, and it seems like this whole rumor got started by a New York paper making up a trade scenario between the two New York teams.


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Offline  Re: Syndergaard and deGrom
#39

Posted: June 09, 2018, 9:31 AM Post
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Look at what it took to get JD Martinez last year. Save the top prospects and go get a rental bat for cheap.


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Offline  Re: Syndergaard and deGrom
#40

Posted: June 09, 2018, 10:40 AM Post
Posts: 4133
Save the top prospects and go get a rental bat for cheap.


The problem is this team isn’t a cheap rental bat away from being a legitimate World Seties contender. I just shutter to think of going into the playoffs with Chacin as our best starting pitcher.

As far as the insistence Hader has to be included I don’t see it. Hader is not a young prospect anymore. He’s a very important piece to the current team. Why would the Mets expect us to give up possibly our most valuable pitcher when we are clearly in win now mode? We have plenty of good, major league or near major league prospects to offer. Whether or not they are good enough is the question.


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