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Jackie Bradley Jr.

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Offline  Re: Jackie Bradley Jr.
Posted: February 23, 2021, 11:56 AM Post
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Jopal78! said:
No team is taking on Lorenzo Cain for $35 million dollars and giving up something in return, and the Brewers don't typically include cash in trades. That tells you where Cain will be playing if he plays.

I agree with your initial premise, Cain has negative value when his remaining contract is considered. I also agree it’s extremely unlikely the Brewers would consider including substantial cash to move Cain. The part I would disagree with a bit is that it’s completely unfeasible he could be traded (although I’ll admit it’s “unlikely”). I think the only way a trade could make sense is if moving Cain coincided with another “bad” contract coming back to Milwaukee.

For example purposes, lets say the Phillies were interested in Cain since they don’t really have a center fielder. The Brewers could take back Scott Kingery who has some positional flexibility in the deal and his remaining two-years and $15.5 million guaranteed (including buyout). For the Phillies the motivation over just signing JBJ may be that it both transfers some already allocated money towards a different player while also freeing up a roster spot from a player that hasn’t been very good recently. In any similar scenario it’s still likely the Brewers may have to include some cash, but not nearly what they would if they weren’t taking back such a contract.


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Offline  Re: Jackie Bradley Jr.
Posted: February 23, 2021, 12:51 PM Post
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Eye Black said:
For example purposes, lets say the Phillies were interested in Cain since they don’t really have a center fielder. The Brewers could take back Scott Kingery who has some positional flexibility in the deal and his remaining two-years and $15.5 million guaranteed (including buyout). For the Phillies the motivation over just signing JBJ may be that it both transfers some already allocated money towards a different player while also freeing up a roster spot from a player that hasn’t been very good recently. In any similar scenario it’s still likely the Brewers may have to include some cash, but not nearly what they would if they weren’t taking back such a contract.

Without taking into account the clubhouse and leadership angle (which with Cain is enormous IMO), this trade might actually make some sense. The Brewers get out from the contract and gain someone who could theoretically be the 3B of the future, even though he is already 27 this year. Sign JBJ to fill in for Cain in CF.

I wouldn't do it because of Cain's value outside of the foul lines, but I could understand the rationale.


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Offline  Re: Jackie Bradley Jr.
Posted: February 23, 2021, 12:53 PM Post
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https://twitter.com/ChrisCotillo/status ... gr%5Etweet


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Offline  Re: Jackie Bradley Jr.
Posted: February 23, 2021, 12:57 PM Post
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BestInTheWorld said:
https://twitter.com/ChrisCotillo/status/1364284788375498764?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Etweet


Probably not going to be a Brewer, then, unless that "next step" doesn't materialize. Stearns tends to set a value on players, and doesn't exceed it. I don't know if he's ever gotten in a bidding war over a player.

Formerly Joey Meyer Bombs


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Offline  Re: Jackie Bradley Jr.
Posted: February 23, 2021, 1:06 PM Post
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Ron Robinson's Beard said:
BestInTheWorld said:
https://twitter.com/ChrisCotillo/status/1364284788375498764?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Etweet


Probably not going to be a Brewer, then, unless that "next step" doesn't materialize. Stearns tends to set a value on players, and doesn't exceed it. I don't know if he's ever gotten in a bidding war over a player.

Especially since its not a "need" player - I would agree with you. Seems like this is; He a pretty decent player is still a free agent, would he sign a "prove it" deal with us, ala Moose and Grandal?


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Offline  Re: Jackie Bradley Jr.
Posted: February 23, 2021, 1:21 PM Post
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Well, unless there are other moving parts to this "need", then the Crew may need to step it up to get those other moving parts moving along.


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Offline  Re: Jackie Bradley Jr.
Posted: February 23, 2021, 1:48 PM Post
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BestInTheWorld said:
https://twitter.com/ChrisCotillo/status/1364284788375498764?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Etweet


He would be a luxury so I'm not going to invest as much time into this as Turner which would have been a much more significant addition.


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Offline  Re: Jackie Bradley Jr.
Posted: February 23, 2021, 4:15 PM Post
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BestInTheWorld said:
brewcrewdue80 said:
Are the Brewers at their 40man limit? Sorta like the Dodgers waiting to sign Turner so they can create space for him on 40man. Maybe FO is looking to trade somebody off the 40man before DFA them to create the open spot? Or its vice versa the team JBJ is really trying to sign with needs the extra time. If Shaw is to be the 3b majority of a platoon and JBJ being LH, Vogelbach trade soon?


Yes 40 man is full with Anderson signing.

Technically we would need two 40 man spots... Easy for me, DFA Vogelbach and Black.

Let's not forget that McKinney & Fisher were scrap heap pickups, just like Robertson & Lopes, et al. Depth guys. There are lots of guys like them out there (and for a while this winter it seemed like we signed about half of them).

Sometimes the GM picks guys like them up with the ultimate goal of no one else claiming them on their way off the 40-man & down to AAA because a better player has been acquired. Stearns has done that several times. A couple of those times, we've lost that guy and it turns out to be a roster shuffling gamble we lost (two come to mind: Adrianza & the reliever who we had for like 2 days who turned out to be surprisingly good for the Angels that year).


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Offline  Re: Jackie Bradley Jr.
Posted: February 23, 2021, 4:37 PM Post
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Eye Black said:
Jopal78! said:
No team is taking on Lorenzo Cain for $35 million dollars and giving up something in return, and the Brewers don't typically include cash in trades. That tells you where Cain will be playing if he plays.

I agree with your initial premise, Cain has negative value when his remaining contract is considered. I also agree it’s extremely unlikely the Brewers would consider including substantial cash to move Cain. The part I would disagree with a bit is that it’s completely unfeasible he could be traded (although I’ll admit it’s “unlikely”). I think the only way a trade could make sense is if moving Cain coincided with another “bad” contract coming back to Milwaukee.

For example purposes, lets say the Phillies were interested in Cain since they don’t really have a center fielder. The Brewers could take back Scott Kingery who has some positional flexibility in the deal and his remaining two-years and $15.5 million guaranteed (including buyout). For the Phillies the motivation over just signing JBJ may be that it both transfers some already allocated money towards a different player while also freeing up a roster spot from a player that hasn’t been very good recently. In any similar scenario it’s still likely the Brewers may have to include some cash, but not nearly what they would if they weren’t taking back such a contract.


It may have happened, but off the top of my head I can't think of a trade in the last 25 years where the Brewers included cash; its just not something they do. It is true they could swap Cain for some other team's garbage, but those type of trades usually don't improve the overall talent on either club. Since the Brewers are planning on being competitive in their division this year, I don't see them shuffling pieces around for the sake of doing it without improving the overall talent level on the 26 man roster.


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Offline  Re: Jackie Bradley Jr.
Posted: February 24, 2021, 9:39 AM Post
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Jopal78! said:
It may have happened, but off the top of my head I can't think of a trade in the last 25 years where the Brewers included cash; its just not something they do. It is true they could swap Cain for some other team's garbage, but those type of trades usually don't improve the overall talent on either club. Since the Brewers are planning on being competitive in their division this year, I don't see them shuffling pieces around for the sake of doing it without improving the overall talent level on the 26 man roster.


"Garbage for garbage" might work in a situation where one team has an overpaid veteran blocking a prospect at one position, and they find a team that has an overpaid veteran at a position where they need help. I agree with you that it doesn't make sense here, because Cain is only "blocking" someone if the Brewers were to sign another high-priced veteran (Bradley). They'd be creating a "jam" simply to trade for someone else's garbage... doesn't make sense.

If the Brewers were to sign Bradley, I think all four of the OFs would remain Brewers to start the season. Garcia would likely see the biggest decline in playing time, but all four of them would get some necessary days off, so there would be PT for all of them. As it stands right now, someone like Taylor is probably going to get quite a few starts this season. The Brewers have some extra money to spend, so they'd rather see those starts go to a better player, while at the same time filling the hole that will arise next offseason when Garcia is gone.

"The most successful (people) know that performance over the long haul is what counts. If you can seize the day, great. But never forget that there are days yet to come."

~Bill Walsh


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Offline  Re: Jackie Bradley Jr.
Posted: February 24, 2021, 9:48 AM Post
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monty57 said:
If the Brewers were to sign Bradley, I think all four of the OFs would remain Brewers to start the season. Garcia would likely see the biggest decline in playing time, but all four of them would get some necessary days off, so there would be PT for all of them. As it stands right now, someone like Taylor is probably going to get quite a few starts this season. The Brewers have some extra money to spend, so they'd rather see those starts go to a better player, while at the same time filling the hole that will arise next offseason when Garcia is gone.

Taylor...Or Fisher...Or McKinney. As Monty points out, Taylor is the likely candidate and I wouldn't be all that unhappy with him as the fourth OF. I think he could provide a similar slash line to Bradley, without the power, and 75-80% of the defense for almost $10m less.

My fear is signing Bradley and limiting the Brewers ability in the middle of the season or next offseason to trade for or sign someone with a larger salary.


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Offline  Re: Jackie Bradley Jr.
Posted: February 24, 2021, 10:40 AM Post
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monty57 said:
Jopal78! said:
It may have happened, but off the top of my head I can't think of a trade in the last 25 years where the Brewers included cash; its just not something they do. It is true they could swap Cain for some other team's garbage, but those type of trades usually don't improve the overall talent on either club. Since the Brewers are planning on being competitive in their division this year, I don't see them shuffling pieces around for the sake of doing it without improving the overall talent level on the 26 man roster.


"Garbage for garbage" might work in a situation where one team has an overpaid veteran blocking a prospect at one position, and they find a team that has an overpaid veteran at a position where they need help. I agree with you that it doesn't make sense here, because Cain is only "blocking" someone if the Brewers were to sign another high-priced veteran (Bradley). They'd be creating a "jam" simply to trade for someone else's garbage... doesn't make sense.

If the Brewers were to sign Bradley, I think all four of the OFs would remain Brewers to start the season. Garcia would likely see the biggest decline in playing time, but all four of them would get some necessary days off, so there would be PT for all of them. As it stands right now, someone like Taylor is probably going to get quite a few starts this season. The Brewers have some extra money to spend, so they'd rather see those starts go to a better player, while at the same time filling the hole that will arise next offseason when Garcia is gone.


How do they know if Taylor is going to be good or not if they don't play him as the 4th OF?
I think it's premature to say we need someone better when we don't truly know what we have in Taylor.
I feel he has done a great job in his limited playing time.
Would be nice to actually know what he is capable of at the big league level.


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Offline  Re: Jackie Bradley Jr.
Posted: February 24, 2021, 11:44 AM Post
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BestInTheWorld said:
https://twitter.com/ChrisCotillo/status/1364284788375498764?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcamp%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Etweet


the next step

Image


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Offline  Re: Jackie Bradley Jr.
Posted: February 24, 2021, 12:57 PM Post
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No offense to Mr Bradley, but if him joining the team means Lo Cain is heading elsewhere... boo-urns.


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Online  Re: Jackie Bradley Jr.
Posted: February 24, 2021, 1:10 PM Post
Posts: 1437
Location: Washburn, WI
With the now deadened baseball so more balls staying in play, defense will play an even bigger role this season. With the Brewers focusing on improving the infield defense significantly with the change of the worst second baseman in baseball to the best defensively, an improvement at third base in Shaw, the return of a gold glove center fielder, and a possible addition of Jackie Bradley Jr. to roam in the same outfield as Cain, we could arguably have the best defense in baseball. Pair that with Woodruff and Burnes at the top of the rotation and a ground ball pitcher like Anderson, they are clearly banking on less home runs this season with the change in the baseball and moving toward run prevention to win games.

With significant progression to the mean for guys like Yelich, Hiura, and Narvaez, the offense will be fine. If Cain, Wong, and Garcia can just be average, we will be fine.


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Offline  Re: Jackie Bradley Jr.
Posted: February 24, 2021, 1:11 PM Post
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josh said:
No offense to Mr Bradley, but if him joining the team means Lo Cain is heading elsewhere... boo-urns.


Won't matter, Bradley isnt signing with us... Would have happened already after the tweet of us showing interest.


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Online  Re: Jackie Bradley Jr.
Posted: February 24, 2021, 1:14 PM Post
Posts: 1437
Location: Washburn, WI
BestInTheWorld said:
josh said:
No offense to Mr Bradley, but if him joining the team means Lo Cain is heading elsewhere... boo-urns.


Won't matter, Bradley isnt signing with us... Would have happened already after the tweet of us showing interest.


Generally true, but Cain signed with us 3 or 4 days after the initial report of the Brewers’ interest. I do think the Crew are in the running for signing him.


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Offline  Re: Jackie Bradley Jr.
Posted: February 24, 2021, 1:17 PM Post
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RollieTime said:
BestInTheWorld said:
josh said:
No offense to Mr Bradley, but if him joining the team means Lo Cain is heading elsewhere... boo-urns.


Won't matter, Bradley isnt signing with us... Would have happened already after the tweet of us showing interest.


Generally true, but Cain signed with us 3 or 4 days after the initial report of the Brewers’ interest. I do think the Crew are in the running for signing him.


I'm just going off the MO of this offseason... Whenever there was a tweet on a player and us, they were signed within a couple hours.


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Offline  Re: Jackie Bradley Jr.
Posted: February 24, 2021, 1:25 PM Post
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RollieTime said:
BestInTheWorld said:
josh said:
No offense to Mr Bradley, but if him joining the team means Lo Cain is heading elsewhere... boo-urns.


Won't matter, Bradley isnt signing with us... Would have happened already after the tweet of us showing interest.


Generally true, but Cain signed with us 3 or 4 days after the initial report of the Brewers’ interest. I do think the Crew are in the running for signing him.

Even longer than that. Ken Rosenthal reported the Brewers interest in Cain in early January that off-season, and it obviously came to fruition three weeks later.

If I remember correctly the whispers about the Brewers having interest in Moustakas also started during the off-season, and then they ultimately traded for him many months later in the days leading up to the mid-season trade deadline.


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Offline  Re: Jackie Bradley Jr.
Posted: February 24, 2021, 1:29 PM Post
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Hopper said:
How do they know if Taylor is going to be good or not if they don't play him as the 4th OF?
I think it's premature to say we need someone better when we don't truly know what we have in Taylor.
I feel he has done a great job in his limited playing time.
Would be nice to actually know what he is capable of at the big league level.


I don't disagree with you, I was saying that if the Brewers sign him, that would seem to be their line of reasoning.

Taylor has some potential, but he's probably not the type of player that you go out of your way to find playing time for. The Brewers can't be too optimistic about Taylor's ability, or they wouldn't have made so many moves to acquire "bounce back candidate" veteran outfielders.

Edit: I generally like giving prospects a chance, as the Brewers need to have a number of pre-arby guys on the roster if they want to be able to fit some expensive guys into their budget. I too would like to see Taylor get a shot, but he's far from a "top prospect." They really need to strengthen their farm.

"The most successful (people) know that performance over the long haul is what counts. If you can seize the day, great. But never forget that there are days yet to come."

~Bill Walsh


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