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job-seeker contacts/advice

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Offline  Re: job-seeker contacts/advice
Posted: September 09, 2015, 10:02 PM Post
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jerichoholicninja said:
Has it always been this damn hard to get a job? Literally every place I've dealt with has been this same crap. I'm sick of getting lied to, ignored, jerked around.

Only when you are recently out of school. I just finished the UW MBA program in May -a top-10 public school MBA program - and I'm still looking because I'm a career switcher. Great phone interviews, but decisions are still made on paper, and if a hiring manager isn't connected to the MBA program I usually get nowhere because they value experience more than the MBA program. Once you get 3-4 years of experience in your field things get much easier. I would have been employed before graduating if I had 3-4 years of experience in my field prior to the MBA program.

One last bit of advice. Every job can generally be classified as one of two types - a revenue-generator or a cost center. Revenue-generating positions (typically sales) get filled quickly (unless there is some major realignment coming soon), so I'm assuming your field is a cost center. Think about that from the employer's perspective. Then focus not on you (when they will make a decision), but on them and how you will justify the cost of employing you. Focus on what you can do for them, how you can solve their problems; focus on how you can either a) increase revenue or b) reduce costs. Find out what their biggest problems are, and tell them how you can help solve them.


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Offline  Re: job-seeker contacts/advice
Posted: September 11, 2015, 6:54 AM Post
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jerichoholicninja said:
Has it always been this damn hard to get a job? Literally every place I've dealt with has been this same crap. I'm sick of getting lied to, ignored, jerked around.


What industry or type of career are you pursuing? Maybe someone here can help.

Not all employers are like that, jerking prospective applicants around needlessly...it sounds like maybe you just need to broaden your search outside of a narrow niche, maybe?

The Paul Molitor Statue at Miller Park: http://www.facebook.com/paulmolitorstatue


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Offline  Re: job-seeker contacts/advice
Posted: September 11, 2015, 8:47 AM Post
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Invader3K said:
jerichoholicninja said:
Has it always been this damn hard to get a job? Literally every place I've dealt with has been this same crap. I'm sick of getting lied to, ignored, jerked around.


What industry or type of career are you pursuing? Maybe someone here can help.

Not all employers are like that, jerking prospective applicants around needlessly...it sounds like maybe you just need to broaden your search outside of a narrow niche, maybe?


No, believe me I've covered every type of industry. For profit, not for profit, schools, government, large businesses, small businesses, it's pretty much all been the same result. My uncle went through the same thing a couple years ago after he was laid off with his job search for a totally different type of work. I remember my immediate family (none of whom have had to look for a job in 15+ years) being shocked and appalled that my uncle who had almost 20 years of experience was going through the same things I was. And to be honest, I don't think most of them believed me before.

As for the job at hand, they actually got a hold of me yesterday and want me to come in next week to discuss salary and compensation so maybe this is actually going to happen.


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Offline  Re: job-seeker contacts/advice
Posted: September 13, 2015, 6:32 AM Post
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jerichoholicninja said:
As for the job at hand, they actually got a hold of me yesterday and want me to come in next week to discuss salary and compensation so maybe this is actually going to happen.


That's good news...hope it works out for you.

And yes, the things some companies now make prospective job applicants go through are pretty ridiculous. I think the era of online applications has made things worse, especially for the unemployed.

The Paul Molitor Statue at Miller Park: http://www.facebook.com/paulmolitorstatue


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Offline  Re: job-seeker contacts/advice
Posted: September 13, 2015, 8:45 AM Post
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Invader3K said:
jerichoholicninja said:
As for the job at hand, they actually got a hold of me yesterday and want me to come in next week to discuss salary and compensation so maybe this is actually going to happen.


That's good news...hope it works out for you.

And yes, the things some companies now make prospective job applicants go through are pretty ridiculous. I think the era of online applications has made things worse, especially for the unemployed.


Oh gosh, don't even get me started on that crap.


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Offline  Re: job-seeker contacts/advice
Posted: November 19, 2015, 5:28 PM Post
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Location: Phoenix, AZ
So for a job that I have applied for they want me to do a digital interview. Basically I have to record myself answering some questions that they have with a webcam. I have never done this before and just find this weird but I have already done the phone interview with the HR person and this is the next step before I get an interview with the hiring manager.

Has anyone done one of these before? Any tips or tricks that I should know about? They said do not worry about the quality of the video so I think any type of a webcam should do.


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Offline  Re: job-seeker contacts/advice
Posted: November 20, 2015, 4:18 PM Post
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So the epilogue to my previously posted about job situation.

I actually got it and started there about 2 months ago. I was so excited to get out of somewhere I did not want to be anymore and work somewhere where I got to do things I liked and work with awesome people.

Today they told us they are closing at the end of the month. My never ending job search continues.


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Offline  Re: job-seeker contacts/advice
Posted: November 20, 2015, 5:38 PM Post
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So I did my digital interview today and it was one of the weirdest things I have ever done. It was very hard for me to even decide when I was done answering a question. This is extremely difficult as I had no visual clues or even audible clues from someone that this was the answering they were looking for. It felt like I was just rambling and I was one of those crazy people on YouTube.


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Offline  Re: job-seeker contacts/advice
Posted: November 21, 2015, 6:51 AM Post
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jerichoholicninja said:
So the epilogue to my previously posted about job situation.

I actually got it and started there about 2 months ago. I was so excited to get out of somewhere I did not want to be anymore and work somewhere where I got to do things I liked and work with awesome people.

Today they told us they are closing at the end of the month. My never ending job search continues.


That stinks, but at least look at the bright side...you now have some very relevant and recent experience that will make you more marketable to other employers.

The Paul Molitor Statue at Miller Park: http://www.facebook.com/paulmolitorstatue


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Offline  Re: job-seeker contacts/advice
Posted: November 21, 2015, 10:25 AM Post
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Not sure what difference having 2 months of a job that I was still being trained for at the end on my resume will make. Also not looking forward to having to explain in interviews that with the only two "real" jobs I've ever had, the business closed a few months after I was hired.


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Offline  Re: job-seeker contacts/advice
Posted: November 21, 2015, 11:53 AM Post
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Time Warner always seems to be hiring B2B reps downtown, if you have some sales experience might be worth a look. PM me if you're interested.


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Offline  Re: job-seeker contacts/advice
Posted: November 23, 2015, 11:06 AM Post
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Location: Waukesha, WI
jerichoholicninja said:
So the epilogue to my previously posted about job situation.

I actually got it and started there about 2 months ago. I was so excited to get out of somewhere I did not want to be anymore and work somewhere where I got to do things I liked and work with awesome people.

Today they told us they are closing at the end of the month. My never ending job search continues.


That may have been the source of their hesitation to hire you to begin with. They uncertain of their future(?)


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Offline  Re: job-seeker contacts/advice
Posted: November 23, 2015, 11:19 AM Post
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Jericho, I may have missed it somewhere, but what type of position are you looking for? (Doctor, steamfitter, actor, IT, truck driver?) That will help me (and maybe others) figure out if we can help or not. It sucks, been there, done that. You will eventually find something that's right for you, and lasts more than two months. Just very frustrating getting through these phases in life.


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Offline  Re: job-seeker contacts/advice
Posted: November 23, 2015, 12:40 PM Post
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FVBrewerFan said:
Jericho, I may have missed it somewhere, but what type of position are you looking for? (Doctor, steamfitter, actor, IT, truck driver?) That will help me (and maybe others) figure out if we can help or not. It sucks, been there, done that. You will eventually find something that's right for you, and lasts more than two months. Just very frustrating getting through these phases in life.


My degree is in Graphic Design but most "Design" positions require more than design and are more marketing and web design orientated. Which I actually have a fair bit of marketing and sales experience, especially compared to other designers. However, I have very little web design experience and a lot of employers want that but I have no interest in learning it. I've tried, it's frustrating, and I hate it.

Overall though, I really don't know what I'm looking for. I've liked what I've done so far but I haven't loved it. There are a couple different fields I think I would enjoy but they would require a move which would make no sense for us right now. Asking my wife to leave her job would not make any financial sense and she actually loves her job. I've got some freelance clients that were bringing in decent money for a little while. But my biggest one decided they would rather hire an expensive marketing firm which I can't believe is saving them any money. I also have a somewhat successful online business. My wife and I are expecting in Spring and I think ultimately I'll just end up staying at home with the baby since it will cost less than paying for child care.


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Offline  Re: job-seeker contacts/advice
Posted: April 12, 2016, 7:41 PM Post
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Is it normal to complete some type of task / case study as part of an interview process?

When I began interviewing for my first professional job in 2010, I willingly jumped through all sorts of hoops. Now, I'm fairly well established in my field. After spending my rookie year with a competitor, I've been with my current employer for 5 years. It has been (and still is) a reasonably good situation. Recently, after learning that my wife and I are expecting our first child, I applied for a job with another competitor out of concern that I may be currently leaving some money on the table. I completed a phone screen and an in-person interview; however, when the recruiter called to arrange a second interview, she asked me to complete a case study prior to the meeting. I was a little taken aback by this request. For one, I will not complete work for this company while still drawing a salary from my current employer. That's an integrity issue. And two, why should I have to try out? I'm just testing free agency. My resume is pretty competitive. They could have tested my chops during the first interview, but they stuck with all softball questions.

If you've continued reading to this point and gotten past my sense of Millennial entitlement, kudos. [tongue]

Upon reflection, my wife and I decided that it would be best to stay with my current employer. With parenthood looming, we valued stability over a little extra cushion in our budget. I politely declined the second interview and cited this reason so that I could keep the door open for the future. Honestly, the biggest reason why I decided to stay put was because of my current supervisor. He's a great person / manager and I want to continue to develop under his guidance. A few other factors came in to play, but the "tryout" was definitely a con.


Last edited by nodakfan17 on April 12, 2016, 8:40 PM, edited 1 time in total.

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Offline  Re: job-seeker contacts/advice
Posted: April 12, 2016, 8:26 PM Post
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A case study now is fairly common - had a couple of those - but typically they give you the data/scenario. I don't find it an issue when they give you the data/scenario, so long as they don't ask you to divulge anything regarding your current employer. What they want to do is see how you think, how you analyze, etc. - it's more about how you do things than the actual analysis you come up with.


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Offline  Re: job-seeker contacts/advice
Posted: April 13, 2016, 6:53 AM Post
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Yes, I think that is somewhat the norm these days. Part of the reason they do it is to make sure they don't have someone who can talk a big game, but doesn't have the ability to back it up. As a recruiter, I always tell the people I work with, if you like your job but are underpaid, ask for a raise. I'm sure most companies have policy on this, how often you can do that, but maybe this would be a good time. Make a case for why you feel you are underpaid for your skill set and the worst they can do is say no.


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Offline  Re: job-seeker contacts/advice
Posted: April 13, 2016, 7:47 AM Post
Posts: 5736
nodakfan17 said:
If you've continued reading to this point and gotten past my sense of Millennial entitlement, kudos. [tongue]


Honestly, that was my reaction to your post. It makes perfect sense for a company to take potential candidates for a test drive. Sounds like you were well qualified for the position, but they probably had other candidates who were just as qualified. It almost sounds like you're saying "how dare they make me do all that when I wasn't really interested anyhow."

Now, if this case study involves doing any work that would compete directly against your present employer, I agree with you that's an integrity issue. But usually when companies do this, the case study is more generic in nature.


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Offline  Re: job-seeker contacts/advice
Posted: April 13, 2016, 11:26 AM Post
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nodakfan17 said:
Is it normal to complete some type of task / case study as part of an interview process?

When I began interviewing for my first professional job in 2010, I willingly jumped through all sorts of hoops. Now, I'm fairly well established in my field. After spending my rookie year with a competitor, I've been with my current employer for 5 years. It has been (and still is) a reasonably good situation. Recently, after learning that my wife and I are expecting our first child, I applied for a job with another competitor out of concern that I may be currently leaving some money on the table. I completed a phone screen and an in-person interview; however, when the recruiter called to arrange a second interview, she asked me to complete a case study prior to the meeting. I was a little taken aback by this request. For one, I will not complete work for this company while still drawing a salary from my current employer. That's an integrity issue. And two, why should I have to try out? I'm just testing free agency. My resume is pretty competitive. They could have tested my chops during the first interview, but they stuck with all softball questions.

If you've continued reading to this point and gotten past my sense of Millennial entitlement, kudos. [tongue]

Upon reflection, my wife and I decided that it would be best to stay with my current employer. With parenthood looming, we valued stability over a little extra cushion in our budget. I politely declined the second interview and cited this reason so that I could keep the door open for the future. Honestly, the biggest reason why I decided to stay put was because of my current supervisor. He's a great person / manager and I want to continue to develop under his guidance. A few other factors came in to play, but the "tryout" was definitely a con.


1) Congrats on the soon-to-be parent!
2) Try outs are the norm... at least in my field (I.T.) Companies use it as a final screening process. Who you are on paper doesn't compare (at all) to who you are analytically/socially/ability-wise... which is who they want to hire.
3) If you like your current supervisor and you have the ability to grow at your current job, stay there. You'll find there are a lot more terrible bosses than good ones. Companies are starting to learn this, but, it's a slow process. For example, in IT, many companies, once you get to a point as a programmer, your next step is to become a manager. What does being an amazing programmer have to do with being a good manager? Absolutely nothing. Not a single thing. Leads to a lot of awful managers.

"I wasted so much time in my life hating Juventus or A.C. Milan that I should have spent hating the Cardinals." ~kalle8

Twitter: @MKEHiker
Website: http://www.mkehiker.com


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Offline  Re: job-seeker contacts/advice
Posted: April 13, 2016, 9:13 PM Post
Posts: 378
Thanks for weighing in on the case study and correcting my perception of this requirement.

On the Subject of Millennial Entitlement ...

This is not a "Why can't they see how special I am?" type of situation, but I understand how my initial post read without proper context. My wife is currently working on a one-year contract. She took a pay cut to leave her former employer of 5 years and accept her current position, which aligned better with her career interests. When we learned about the pregnancy (it was a surprise), there was a 50/50 shot that her contract would not be renewed. With fatherhood on the Horizon, my initial reaction was to find a higher-paying job so that I could replace part of her income, if necessary. When I say that I'm currently leaving money on the table, I'm not suggesting that my employer treats me unfairly (quite the contrary, actually). I value a lot of intangibles like a short commute, a great relationship with my manager, and a flexible work schedule. I know that I could earn more with a different employer, but that might come at the expense of these other benefits. However, when faced with a budget crunch, wouldn't most parents put their children ahead of their own comfort? I'm not even a true Millennial. I don't have student loans, I buy my morning coffee at the gas station, and I only have an iPhone 4 (gasp). [smile]

On the Actual Case Study ...

I'm not offended by the case study requirement (just surprised). They emailed me a proprietary dataset and asked me to provide some preliminary analysis. I'm sure the company just intended to use it as an evaluation tool, but had they retained it, it would have been a conflict of interest. In retrospect, I could have suggested they have me analyze data from a public source to help alleviate the conflict. Boasting 6 years of experience might seem laughable to some posters, but my skill set has come a long way in that short time. In addition to the acumen I've picked up at the office, I've also built up my software proficiencies during my non-working evenings and weekends. 2010 was a bad time to enter the job market. Without much relevant work experience, I could see why an employer would want to test out a prospective employee. I willingly jumped through a lot of hoops to land that first job. A year later, I was able to leverage that experience into a much better opportunity with my current employer (following a traditional interview, sans case study).

On the Exciting Conclusion ...

In between the phone screen and the first interview, I learned that my wife's contract was likely to be renewed (this time for 2 years). She encouraged me to stay with my current employer where she knows I'm content. I decided to proceed with the interview in case it turned out to be a great opportunity. I had already prepared for it and put in for PTO. As it turned out, it was just OK. I liked the hiring managers just fine, but with the extra pay no longer of great concern, I felt more comfortable with the status quo. I've been surrounded by good people for 5 years (which I'm told is rare). I had nearly made up my mind before the interview concluded, but the homework assignment sealed the deal. When the recruiter called to offer me a second interview, I politely declined and cited our family situation. She was very understanding and encouraged me to contact her directly if I was interested in another posting down the road. As for the case study, I guess I'll just assume that's a given next time.


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