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2017 International Signing Thread

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Offline  Re: 2017 International Signing Thread
#21

Posted: April 16, 2017, 7:52 AM Post
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Is there anyone still out there that the Brewers can use this $885K on? It is for this period only, not next period.


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Offline  Re: 2017 International Signing Thread
#22

Posted: April 16, 2017, 8:33 AM Post
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mattyo said:
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Per @BenBadler report, Brewers get $885,300 to spend on int'l talent in exchange for Damien Magnifico. That's the value of slot No. 15.


The more I look at this, the more curious this acquisition becomes because we have to use this by June 15.

First thing, most of the major international players have already signed. As someone noted, are there really that many quality prospects still available during this signing period? Perhaps there are - I just don't know the rules of who becomes eligible and when.

I do know that some guys become available at odd times - specifically the Cuban players who have had to take up residency in another country. It just takes time for them to get their residency, and then MLB to recognize them. Luis Robert is probably the most talented of these players. He's hoping to be cleared by June 15 by MLB to sign - thus he won't be subject to the new international spending limits.

However, he'll get a ton of money if he's declared a FA prior to June 15. Thus, it's likely that a team like San Diego - which has already committed $70-80M during the past year to international players - will just bite the bullet, give him $10M or $15M or whatever - and take the penalty. The extra $885,300 isn't going to land us a guy like Robert.

Again, are there other quality players that just haven't signed? And if there are, is the $885,300 really going to get them?

Again, let's say there is an international player or two the we really like. Why isn't a team like the Padres (or whoever) just outbid us? I mean, they've blown through $80M - why not $85M at this point?

So I'm not sure what the $885,300 does for us. Maybe it just allows us to add a bunch of lower ranked guys - but again, who are these players? If they were that good, why haven't they already signed? My only guess is that some players just emerge over the course of the past year, and we can use the money to try and get a few of them. I'm assuming we have a plan of some kind - so it will be interesting to see what we do.

It would have been nice if this had been for the next signing period - but such is life.


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Offline  Re: 2017 International Signing Thread
#23

Posted: April 17, 2017, 2:43 PM Post
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Is there any reason why the two deals with Baltimore were separated in the first place? I could see this slot money not being used and the trades end up being Magnifico for Drake (no PTBN or cash exchanged).


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Offline  Re: 2017 International Signing Thread
#24

Posted: April 20, 2017, 10:23 AM Post
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Luis Robert is now a free agent. Is this where we take advantage of our extra bonus pool money?

https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2017/04/ ... agent.html


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Online  Re: 2017 International Signing Thread
#25

Posted: April 20, 2017, 10:31 AM Post
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Robert is probably going to get a lot more money than the Brewers have bonus pool room. One of the teams already way over the cap are the most likely, because they can't be penalized any more in terms of limitations on what they can do next signing period.


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Offline  Re: 2017 International Signing Thread
#26

Posted: April 20, 2017, 12:09 PM Post
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http://m.mlb.com/news/article/225439776 ... =151437456


Looks like the teams that overspent last yr will have the opportunity to throw as much money at him as they want.. its sad the Brewers are not in play.. They have no money tied into their payroll. I don't care that he is an outfielder and that is our strength in the minors. This guy looks to be a stud and is young.... There is no reason not to go for this guy.. He can either be a franchise player or down the road you trade him at the TD and get even more prospects.. as long as he lives up to the hype.. There have not been too many disappointments as top international stars like him...


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Offline  Re: 2017 International Signing Thread
#27

Posted: April 20, 2017, 12:17 PM Post
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leitermab07 said:
http://m.mlb.com/news/article/225439776/cuban-of-luis-robert-cleared-to-sign-with-club/?topicid=151437456


Looks like the teams that overspent last yr will have the opportunity to throw as much money at him as they want.. its sad the Brewers are not in play.. They have no money tied into their payroll. I don't care that he is an outfielder and that is our strength in the minors. This guy looks to be a stud and is young.... There is no reason not to go for this guy.. He can either be a franchise player or down the road you trade him at the TD and get even more prospects.. as long as he lives up to the hype.. There have not been too many disappointments as top international stars like him...
That's because you only hear about the ones that don't fail. One example of a recent "can't miss IP" that fell totally on his face stateside is Gustavo Cabrera for the Giants. We can't afford to miss on these guys if we go over budget because of the tax implications, and being a small market team. Frustrating to say the least, but life isn't fair.


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Offline  Re: 2017 International Signing Thread
#28

Posted: April 20, 2017, 12:36 PM Post
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MilwaukeeBeers said:
leitermab07 said:
http://m.mlb.com/news/article/225439776/cuban-of-luis-robert-cleared-to-sign-with-club/?topicid=151437456


Looks like the teams that overspent last yr will have the opportunity to throw as much money at him as they want.. its sad the Brewers are not in play.. They have no money tied into their payroll. I don't care that he is an outfielder and that is our strength in the minors. This guy looks to be a stud and is young.... There is no reason not to go for this guy.. He can either be a franchise player or down the road you trade him at the TD and get even more prospects.. as long as he lives up to the hype.. There have not been too many disappointments as top international stars like him...
That's because you only hear about the ones that don't fail. One example of a recent "can't miss IP" that fell totally on his face stateside is Gustavo Cabrera for the Giants. We can't afford to miss on these guys if we go over budget because of the tax implications, and being a small market team. Frustrating to say the least, but life isn't fair.


You say "being a small market team" but in that same article it lists as favorites to sign Robert: A's, Cardinals, Padres and Reds. Not exactly the NYs or Bostons of the league...

At some point we are going to have to take advantage of or next to nothing payroll and gamble. The play it safe stuff isnt going to win us a championship (not saying we MUST sign Robert, but more generally).


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Offline  Re: 2017 International Signing Thread
#29

Posted: April 20, 2017, 1:11 PM Post
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I know that I don't completely understand the International market, but I do wonder why we aren't being a little more aggressive in this area during our rebuild? When teams like the A's, Pads and Reds are all going hard after this Luis Robert kid, it seems like we should be putting our hat in the ring as well - even if we do have to face penalties for it. Our MLB payroll is down right now, so why not use some of that money to invest in our future with some high end international players?

OK - the experts can now feel free to tell me how wrong that I am, and how I don't understand the system! [smile]


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Offline  Re: 2017 International Signing Thread
#30

Posted: April 20, 2017, 2:29 PM Post
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yes, I do know many of the international top prospects that have flamed out, but I also know that most of the star players in the game or in the minors were from the international free agency. I never understood fans thinking that the Brewers money is theres'? You HAVE to take chances on these international players to get the top elite players. There is no evidence of us getting any Star players in the draft since the Brauns/Fielder days. so when you have a low payroll these are the times to spend money and take chances. To say they might be a bust and you should not spend on them is only hurting the franchise. drafting and overpaying draft picks is just as much of a risk as international players. Especially, if this is going to be the last time that teams can just spend whatever they want on international players. Texas, Boston, Chicago, and Dodgers have been the top teams to spend internationally the last couple of years. I'd say that worked out quite well for them. loaded major league clubs and loaded minor league players. I know these are big markets, but the fact that Brewers are not even dipping their toe in those waters is disappointing.


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Offline  Re: 2017 International Signing Thread
#31

Posted: April 21, 2017, 5:01 AM Post
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leitermab07 said:
yes, I do know many of the international top prospects that have flamed out, but I also know that most of the star players in the game or in the minors were from the international free agency. I never understood fans thinking that the Brewers money is theres'?

This just isn’t true. Of the top 20 fWAR position players in 2016, only 3 were J2 signings (Altuve, Beltre, and Cano). Of the top 20 fWAR pitchers in 2016, only 2 were J2 signings (Cueto, Quintana). The best ball players in the world are still made right here in the ol’ US of A.

In general, I think Brewer fans are more willing to give ownership the benefit of the doubt because they have shown willingness to spend on a competitive product. From 2007-2015, the Brewers never fielded a payroll in the bottom 10 despite being definitively the smallest market in the game.

The Brewers chose to not to be restricted in the new CBA's level playing field. (They may have also miscalculated thinking they were in line for a potential high draft choice with the MLB team current position in the competitive cycle when a draft appeared to be the direction). Its too early to know if that was the right strategy.


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Offline  Re: 2017 International Signing Thread
#32

Posted: April 21, 2017, 8:44 AM Post
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mattyo said:
that same article it lists as favorites to sign Robert: A's, Cardinals, Padres and Reds. Not exactly the NYs or Bostons of the league...

Several teams, including the Angels, Blue Jays, Cubs, D-backs, Dodgers, Rays, Red Sox, Royals and Yankees, cannot sign a player for more than $300K this singing period, so they are out.

I would also not put it past the commissioner to throw the book at someone who egregiously goes over the pool allotment, a la the Red Sox, and ban them from signing anyone at all next year, much less under $300K.

What the Brewers can do is trade this newly acquired bonus pool allotment to one of said teams above if the Brewers aren't in the hunt. A team can acquire cap room for players who haven't signed yet, so if a team is close to signing him then that $880K allotment could be very valuable to keep them out of a penalty, or more severe penalty.


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Offline  Re: 2017 International Signing Thread
#33

Posted: April 22, 2017, 8:10 PM Post
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Reading comments that the signing of Robert will cost 25-30mil and ditto when taxed. 50-60million investment. So St Louis and the Padres make it seem most likely. Sadly I think ST. Louis will win signing him as San Diego would be at 130-140million spent for the 16 signing period. Lol!!


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Offline  Re: 2017 International Signing Thread
#34

Posted: April 25, 2017, 11:44 PM Post
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brewcrewdue80 said:
Reading comments that the signing of Robert will cost 25-30mil and ditto when taxed. 50-60million investment. So St Louis and the Padres make it seem most likely. Sadly I think ST. Louis will win signing him as San Diego would be at 130-140million spent for the 16 signing period. Lol!!
Yup waaaaaaaay to rich for our blood, but I really want to take advantage of the old rules while we still can.


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Offline  Re: 2017 International Signing Thread
#35

Posted: April 28, 2017, 8:49 AM Post
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MilwaukeeBeers said:
brewcrewdue80 said:
Reading comments that the signing of Robert will cost 25-30mil and ditto when taxed. 50-60million investment. So St Louis and the Padres make it seem most likely. Sadly I think ST. Louis will win signing him as San Diego would be at 130-140million spent for the 16 signing period. Lol!!
Yup waaaaaaaay to rich for our blood, but I really want to take advantage of the old rules while we still can.


Supposedly Robert has a $25M offer in hand already. That means $50M with tax.

And the process has just started. Price will only go up.

https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2017/04/ ... arket.html


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Offline  Re: 2017 International Signing Thread
#36

Posted: April 29, 2017, 8:23 PM Post
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That is just such a joke considering how the process works for the June Draft and the limitations on money for those players drafted. a #1 pick who may be a 21year old college kid, caps around 8/9? mil. An international kid who defects from his country meanwhile is about to make 25 or more million. I am glad they've changed the rules but to let this kid go available to sign in the '16 period vs. waiting til this July's Signing beginning is terrible. I don't get why there isn't an uproar from teams like Milwaukee on the situation. You changed the rules on the signing period and now after it, you let a kid qualify for the previous signing period? And look what's about to happen. Any of the teams who exploded their limits in '16 are the only ones who have a chance at this kid, and they know how the new system works, the hard cap, no penalties in place now. So it's the last chance to make a move like such. Can't sign anyone over 300k for next 2years. The whole process just a lottery win for Robert, who likely is cashing in 10 mil or more in the bidding war that he wouldn't have experienced otherwise in value.


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Offline  Re: 2017 International Signing Thread
#37

Posted: May 01, 2017, 12:21 PM Post
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brewcrewdue80 said:
That is just such a joke considering how the process works for the June Draft and the limitations on money for those players drafted. a #1 pick who may be a 21year old college kid, caps around 8/9? mil. An international kid who defects from his country meanwhile is about to make 25 or more million. I am glad they've changed the rules but to let this kid go available to sign in the '16 period vs. waiting til this July's Signing beginning is terrible. I don't get why there isn't an uproar from teams like Milwaukee on the situation. You changed the rules on the signing period and now after it, you let a kid qualify for the previous signing period? And look what's about to happen. Any of the teams who exploded their limits in '16 are the only ones who have a chance at this kid, and they know how the new system works, the hard cap, no penalties in place now. So it's the last chance to make a move like such. Can't sign anyone over 300k for next 2years. The whole process just a lottery win for Robert, who likely is cashing in 10 mil or more in the bidding war that he wouldn't have experienced otherwise in value.

The International stuff has been a joke for a long time. This year will finally put teams on an even playing field.

That said, MLB has always simply judged guys like Robert on a case-by-case basis, and once they were ready with him, they had to make him available. It sucks (at least for teams like Milwaukee), but that's life. As you said, it's a huge win for Robert - he'll get $20M+ more than he would have gotten had he been forced to wait a couple of months.

I'm just happy knowing that going forward there will be no more of this kind of thing.


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Offline  Re: 2017 International Signing Thread
#38

Posted: May 02, 2017, 9:26 AM Post
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Still not very fair as any player will prefer the bigger market where they have more $$$$ potential. Way better, but not quite as great if there was a draft in place.


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Online  Re: 2017 International Signing Thread
#39

Posted: May 05, 2017, 8:14 AM Post
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MLB Pipeline have revealed their top 30 international prospects for the upcoming July 2 signing period. The Brewers are still linked to Ernesto and Rodriguez, ranked #14 and #28 respectively. Reading up on Ernesto a bit more, he might be a top 30 Brewers prospect upon signing.

There are also a larger-than-usual number of "uncommitted" prospects the Brewers could still jump in on, including the #6 and #8 prospects on the list.


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Offline  Re: 2017 International Signing Thread
#40

Posted: May 05, 2017, 8:37 AM Post
Posts: 376
How are the under-sanctioned Cubs expected to sign the #30 prospect?


Last edited by ZBTMP on May 05, 2017, 8:39 PM, edited 1 time in total.

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